SOCIALISM Step 4 - Give your power away

~The World bodies UN, IAEC & others were powerless to stop N. Korea from launching a missile. What makes you lefties think that disarming is going to make us more safe in a world that the nuclear deterrent has worked in so far.

Last country to throw it's nukes away WINS!

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Mark de LA says
Immoral countries like N. Korea & Iran would not care what moral authority we muster. It is power & regime survival that they care about. I am not buying your argument.

Mark de LA says

source: ...

He [Obama] didn't say that a nuclear-armed Iranian regime is unacceptable. He didn't express a commitment to preventing such an outcome, or confidence that the United States and international community would prevent such an outcome. He simply suggested that it wouldn't be optimal for Iran to choose that outcome. And if the rulers of the Islamic republic disagree? In the very speech in which Obama outlined his vision of a world without nuclear weapons, he weakened America's stand against Iran's nuclear weapons program.

So while Obama talks of a future without nuclear weapons, the trajectory we are on today is toward a nuclear- and missile-capable North Korea and Iran -- and a far more dangerous world.

...

Seth says

I don't hear anyone talking about unilateral disarmament. But on the other hand it is impossible to argue rationally that keeping thousands of nukes laying around in US, Russia, India, Pakistan, Israel, Britain, France and China is making our world a safer place. Obama's point is to decrease those stockpiles as a first step. Doing that is certainly a prerequisite giving us the moral authority to get countries like Korea and Iran not to develop their own nukes.

Mark de LA says

seth 2009-04-06 14:32:07 11745

As long as we have one they will require one. Remember the SALT-I & II endless debates & subsequent strategic minor reductions? That gave us the world we have today. Notice that Packistan & India got nukes anyway. So no nukes, but bioweapons & chemical weapons become the coice WMDs. Actually, the most chaos seems to be from suicide bombers & IEDs. It's all puff & show by Obama to kiss the rest of the World's ass & try to become equally inept & powerless.

Mark de LA says

seth 2009-04-07 11:18:22 11745

MR 2009-04-06 15:35:13 11745

Immoral countries like N. Korea & Iran would not care what moral authority we muster. It is power & regime survival that they care about. I am not buying your argument.

It's interesting how people think that just by stating "moral authority is meaningless to foreign governments", makes it so. You are not the only one, others are saying it also, and with no more justification than you brought to the table. Remember just saying something does not make it so ... as you have yourself, many times, brought to my attention.

But blatant hypocrisy always means something ... especially when you are on the shitty end of that stick. Also moral authority, sans hypocrisy, is something that enhances the power of the person in authority - it is not granted by the subjects. It is simply a force acquired by doing what is right. So that, in the distant future of a world with no nukes, there will be no hesitations by governments to prevent an Iran or a Korea from attaining nukes - that will be the assumption of all of the world governments. Obama said that he does not expect this world to come about in his life time. But it is time to seriously start moving in that direction. That a American president has officially recognized this hypocritical bug in the proliferation treaties and has set out to fix it tells me that finallly we have an exceptional statesman in the white house.

It is real simple ... when i come to you with bloodied hands and shout no more bloodshed, will you not just post an RWG against me?

This is mostly vindictive spew. You should read more carefully. I say that Iran & N. Korea have no moral authority - not all countries. These two countries & probably a handful of others won't give a shit about whether the USA has any or not. They will defy world opinion to achieve whatever their myopic goals are. So far sanctions & isolation for N. Korea have produced shit. I presume NK are not so stupid as to strike the US. Of course with Obama in charge - who knows? Iran & Ahmadinejad however is another story. He is nuts & has no fear of suicide - ever willing to martyr himself & his country to get rid of the Jews.

You should really read about the SALT-I & II treaties on nukes. You will find that Obama is promising nothing much different (SALT-III?) & today even admits probably not in his life time. He is mainly kissing the asses of the Europe & the Middle East.

Mark de LA says

seth 2009-04-07 02:11:23 11745

MR 2009-04-06 20:02:21 11745

MR 2009-04-06 19:54:00 11745

seth 2009-04-06 19:25:47 11745

William Kristol bemoans that "he didn't say that a nuclear-armed Iranian regime is unacceptable"; but Obama has delivered that specific message already on several occasions. This was not the time or the place to rattle swords ... his message to Turkey and the Muslim world was quite different.

Yep, that was a message that Bush delivered before. Let's see what Iran does with it this time!

Apparently Obama conquered terrorism & won the war on terror because from now on there is only man-caused disasters & overseas contingency operations .

Well i dont like the term "contingency operations" either ... sound like it was made up by someone in the pentagon. Hopefully they will come up with a better term for what used to be the "war on terror" which is pretty stupid if you think about it.

More likely it was made up in the State Department

! Makes as much sense as the other two wars the country has been fighting & losing: the war on drugs & the war on poverty.

Mark de LA says

The UN model of power & efficiency in handling difficult regimes!

Mark de LA says

seth 2009-04-07 10:11:22 11745

If you like saber rattling so much, you should post a cartoon about Gingrich wanting to zap the Korean missile with a laser we don't have. This whole thing has been overplayed. It's times like this that we all can be glad we have the Obama kool in the white house.

Well, the version I read was something else. We do have laser weapons, not exactly Star Trek yet, though. What he thought was a good idea was to disable the missle with EMP devices. You will get a lot more truth in your life if you leave the Huffington Post in the bottom of your bird cage!

Mark de LA says

MR 2009-04-10 07:59:47 11745

~ The Ferengi gets his nuke centrifuges

Drudge headlines follow on the subject...
France concerned...

CLINTON: 'We don't know what to believe'...

Mark de LA says

source: ... So why are we still locked into the vertical non-proliferation model with the Russians? All proliferation roads appear to lead to Moscow, as they've successfully bent the language of both START and the NPT for decades. Simply offering up European missile defense, prompt global strike, and a sizable percentage of our already aging nuclear inventory without aggressively hardening the horizontal proliferation language in the new treaty would be dangerously naive -- and serves only to degrade our strategic strength and embolden our enemies.

...

Obama is negotiating out of weakness... read the whole commentary (it's short & to the point)

Mark de LA says

The Google newsfront on US-Russian summit shows up here. Who knows if the link is static or dynamic? I followed the topic from my main news page. That's about the only way I can get the newsfront graphic. I had to search for Krauthammer's column on the subject mentioned in a few anti-Krauthammer blogs. I suspect that those who read the column & stick to the analysis will have a hard time supporting the President's results. Ad hominem attacks on the messengers of this blog will be thrown away.

Mark de LA says

BTW, the links in your saved google page don't work at all.

Seth says

MR 2009-07-11 08:36:46 11745

BTW, the links in your saved google page don't work at all.

Yeah not unsurprising since Google wants to know what you click on. If necessary the destination link can be extracted from the HTML.

Mark de LA says

seth 2009-07-11 08:12:13 11745

Well the ncl=d729Vh4U-MqAN9M568teQM0FjPfUM in the google news front URL seems to identify the front, so this URL is as good as the one your showed here. I saved the page at fastblogit so that we can check how persistent it is. Come back in a month and see what changed.

I think a foreign policy needs time to make any difference, so I would not expect any dramatic differences to manifest immediately. There was one achievement that was unattainable last fall and that was transit over Russian territory to supply Afghanastan. Take a look at the state of the world after his term in office, compared to what he inherited is, me thinks, a more reasonable way to judge his foreign policy.

... & then vote him & Congress out if he still says at that time it will take still more time, & is still blaming Bush.

Mark de LA says

MR 2009-07-10 19:17:57 11745

seth 2009-07-10 10:47:59 11745

Seems to me this should be the headline under this item today, not the one above ...

source: Obama uses G8 debut to issue warning to Iran (Reuters)
U.S. President Barack Obama warned Iran on Friday the world will not wait indefinitely for it to end its nuclear defiance, saying Tehran had until September to comply or else face consequences.

... which comes away with Obama negotiating from weakness. His issuing the September deadline above does not sound like weakness to me. His trip to Russia also must muster some degree of help from them. Much better than McCain's rhetoric which was heading towards a new cold war. But the Weekly Standard article was interesting ... it is probably true that "all proliferation roads appear to lead to Moscow". That makes Obama's mission to Russia in preparation from his threat to Iran above even more timely.

One is negotiating status on nukes & the other is Iran nukes posturing- quite different. Russia apparently helped Iran. Nothing seems to suggest that Obama achieved anything of substance.

& today in Reuters

MOSCOW (Reuters) - Russia will not agree to tougher sanctions against Iran over its nuclear program in exchange for a new nuclear arms cuts deal with Washington, Interfax news agency quoted a foreign ministry source as saying Tuesday.

Last week, U.S. President Barack Obama's nuclear adviser suggested that progress on a U.S.-Russian nuclear arms pact could help persuade Moscow to be more cooperative on Iran.

"There are no reasons to link these issues or count on Russia being more cooperative in toughening sanctions against Iran if there is progress in talks with the United States on further cuts in strategic offensive weapons," the source said.

...

Yep!

SOCIALISM Step 4 - Give your power away

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