Circle of Life - YouTube
About: youtube - the circle of life - gaza / israel
~see link above for the full cartoon. Iran'Egypt'Gaza'the U.N.'Iran . . . ad infinitum. The current view of the Middle East seems to be captured in these Drudge Headlines:
KING'S ULTIMATUM: Netanyahu meeting decides Mid-East's future...
Peace now or it's war next year...
POLL: Obama more popular than USA among Arabs...
Strategy puts Israel under pressure...
Peace now or it's war next year...
POLL: Obama more popular than USA among Arabs...
Strategy puts Israel under pressure...
~
Meanwhile the Syrians seem to have opened up the AlQueda pipline again even after Obama promises to talk to them and everyone in the Middle East including, perhaps, from a world famous Mosque.
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Tags
- middle east
- infinite loop
- item 12047
Comments
Mark de LA says
MR 2009-05-11 13:45:04 11938
Here is a good state of the situation from the Weekly Standard blog:
Here is a good state of the situation from the Weekly Standard blog:
source: ... Jordanian King: I Will Lead Arab World to Accord with Israel--After U.S. Produces Israeli Concessions��"or War Will Ensue
... concessions or else WAR?
Apparently the king of Jordan is afraid of Netanyahu and perceives Obama to be pro Arab or ??.
Krauthammer: ...
The Palestinians already have a state, an independent territory with not an Israeli settler or soldier living on it. It's called Gaza. And what is it? A terror base, Islamist in nature, Iranian-allied, militant and aggressive, that has fired more than 10,000 rockets and mortars at Israeli civilians.
The Palestinians already have a state, an independent territory with not an Israeli settler or soldier living on it. It's called Gaza. And what is it? A terror base, Islamist in nature, Iranian-allied, militant and aggressive, that has fired more than 10,000 rockets and mortars at Israeli civilians.
...the rest of the article is fairly cogent as well.
the rest of the article is fairly cogent as well.
Mark de LA says
The emergence of Obama Muslim roots comes out as Obama panders to the Arabs. Obama declares that the US is a Muslim nation if you consider the #s in other nations - look here. After previously declaring the US is not a Christian nation. How much more ass kissing can Obama do in the Middle East? Meeting with the Saudi King & agreeing not to let the reporters stray from their hotels to photograph anything else.
Mark de LA says
So why focus on the settlements instead of the terrorist rockets. The last time things were offered to Yasser Arafat he refused the hand outstretched. Now they want to demand everything they could have got previously & ask for more before controlling their own Palestinian population.
Phooey! Let them eat their dates!
Mark de LA says
seth 2009-06-03 15:18:18 11938
MR 2009-06-03 15:04:14 11938
seth 2009-06-03 14:58:51 11938
source: MR above states that
The emergence of Obama Muslim roots comes out as Obama panders to the Arabs.
The emergence of Obama Muslim roots comes out as Obama panders to the Arabs.
I read "The emergence of Obama Muslim roots" carefully and in it's entirety looking for something new that had just emerged now, but i found nothing new. The only new emergence is that Obama is starting a ME tour and a major initiative for peace. Where, MR, is the truth in your statement?
You are awfuly good at playing dumb when you don't like what you are reading. Read it again. It's all in there. He is playing up his muslim background now & before in Turkey. During the campaign he kept it under wraps as much as possible.
Nope, nothing new. If you think that there is something new there then please quote it. Talking about things that were already common knowledgege does not an emergence make. Setting the stage for a major initiative in the Muslim world is all that is happening.
If he now pretends to be a Muslim & on the campaign he pretended to be a Christian he is straddling the rope over the canyon of hypocrisy. Hmmm... I wonder how finding a church in DC is going. You of course didn't touch his comment on this being a Muslim nation from a certain perspective (which was false, anyway) See:
Hmmm... I wonder how finding a church in DC is going. You of course didn't touch his comment on this being a Muslim nation from a certain perspective (which was false, anyway) See:
Mark de LA says
If you follow 12047 's one sided propaganda you would think there is something going on in a tit for tat. OTOH, if you look at the background in the video you might wonder why anyone would like to live in a land that looks like a desert of a pile or rocks. It reminds me a little of the cartoon Finding Nemo & the seagulls all shouting mine mine mine mine....
Seth says
source: MR above states that
The emergence of Obama Muslim roots comes out as Obama panders to the Arabs.
The emergence of Obama Muslim roots comes out as Obama panders to the Arabs.
I read "The emergence of Obama Muslim roots" carefully and in it's entirety looking for something new that had just emerged now, but i found nothing new. The only new emergence is that Obama is starting a ME tour and a major initiative for peace. Where, MR, is the truth in your statement?
Mark de LA says
seth 2009-06-03 14:48:09 11938
MR 2009-06-03 14:23:11 11938
So why focus on the settlements instead of the terrorist rockets. The last time things were offered to Yasser Arafat he refused the hand outstretched. Now they want to demand everything they could have got previously & ask for more before controlling their own Palestinian population.
Phooey! Let them eat their dates!
Well rockets are Palestinian aggression and settlements are Israeli aggression. Both must stop. But using one side to excuse the other side is just a formula for an endless fight.
It's like the Golden Rule & Luke6,41-42 - Who goes first? The Jews are still caught more in an eye-for-eye approach & the Palestinians never had much of a Golden Rule sentiment in the first place. It would be hard to explain how a suicide bomber would be thinking of the Golden Rule while blowing up his people & others' children on a crowded bus.
Mark de LA says
If Netanyahu were to stop all settlement activity, which he has done before, what would the Palestinians want? They would want & demand Jerusalem as their capital & all land returned to the pre-'67 war, eh? So then there would be another impasse & more terror rockets etc. The video lives on. What is needed is Israel's right to exist declared from all Arab/Muslim nations at the start in exchange for settlement activity to cease. Then the rest is barter & negotiation.
Seth says
MR 2009-06-03 14:55:53 11938
If you follow 12047 's one sided propaganda you would think there is something going on in a tit for tat. OTOH, if you look at the background in the video you might wonder why anyone would like to live in a land that looks like a desert of a pile or rocks. It reminds me a little of the cartoon Finding Nemo & the seagulls all shouting mine mine mine mine....
What does "something going on in a tit for tat" refer to? Please note that settlements furnish an excuse for terrorism, but terrorism does not furnish a excuse for settlements.
Btw, there is not suppose to be any "one sided propaganda" included in the body of 12047 and if you see any, please call it to my attention. That item is, however, a single topic item. Only information and views directly bearing on that item are to be included. I do think such a focus is useful, but it does not imply that i think this the only problem in the West Bank.
Btw, there is not suppose to be any "one sided propaganda" included in the body of 12047 and if you see any, please call it to my attention. That item is, however, a single topic item. Only information and views directly bearing on that item are to be included. I do think such a focus is useful, but it does not imply that i think this the only problem in the West Bank.
Seth says
MR 2009-06-03 15:04:14 11938
seth 2009-06-03 14:58:51 11938
source: MR above states that
The emergence of Obama Muslim roots comes out as Obama panders to the Arabs.
The emergence of Obama Muslim roots comes out as Obama panders to the Arabs.
I read "The emergence of Obama Muslim roots" carefully and in it's entirety looking for something new that had just emerged now, but i found nothing new. The only new emergence is that Obama is starting a ME tour and a major initiative for peace. Where, MR, is the truth in your statement?
You are awfuly good at playing dumb when you don't like what you are reading. Read it again. It's all in there. He is playing up his muslim background now & before in Turkey. During the campaign he kept it under wraps as much as possible.
Nope, nothing new. If you think that there is something new there then please quote it. Talking about things that were already common knowledgege does not an emergence make. Setting the stage for a major initiative in the Muslim world is all that is happening.
Mark de LA says
seth 2009-06-03 15:13:02 11938
MR 2009-06-03 14:55:53 11938
If you follow 12047 's one sided propaganda you would think there is something going on in a tit for tat. OTOH, if you look at the background in the video you might wonder why anyone would like to live in a land that looks like a desert of a pile or rocks. It reminds me a little of the cartoon Finding Nemo & the seagulls all shouting mine mine mine mine....
What does "something going on in a tit for tat" refer to? Please note that settlements furnish an excuse for terrorism, but terrorism does not furnish a excuse for settlements.
Btw, there is not suppose to be any "one sided propaganda" included in the body of 12047 and if you see any, please call it to my attention. That item is, however, a single topic item. Only information and views directly bearing on that item are to be included. I do think such a focus is useful, but it does not imply that i think this the only problem in the West Bank.
Btw, there is not suppose to be any "one sided propaganda" included in the body of 12047 and if you see any, please call it to my attention. That item is, however, a single topic item. Only information and views directly bearing on that item are to be included. I do think such a focus is useful, but it does not imply that i think this the only problem in the West Bank.
Israel is fighting for it's life. That's still something that we here in the ivory tower in the US can't really imagine. Netanyahu believes that having outposts in the West bank at least provide some bit of strategic leverage. I have watched him on CNN & FOXNEWS & believe him to be a reasonable man with the fate & security of Israel as his top priority agenda. Obama should have the US as his! The tone of your video seemed one-sided to me.
Seth says
MR 2009-06-03 15:08:51 11938
If Netanyahu were to stop all settlement activity, which he has done before, what would the Palestinians want? They would want & demand Jerusalem as their capital & all land returned to the pre-'67 war, eh? So then there would be another impasse & more terror rockets etc. The video lives on. What is needed is Israel's right to exist declared from all Arab/Muslim nations at the start in exchange for settlement activity to cease. Then the rest is barter & negotiation.
Well i am not in a postion to know anything about what the details of a final agreement should be. I agree that Muslim nations in the ME should recognize Israel's right to exist. I believe that most of them, with the exception of Hamas, Hisbola, and Iran have done that. Nerveless making that a precondition to negotiations would seem like a non starter.
Mark de LA says
seth 2009-06-03 15:31:56 11938
MR 2009-06-03 15:08:51 11938
If Netanyahu were to stop all settlement activity, which he has done before, what would the Palestinians want? They would want & demand Jerusalem as their capital & all land returned to the pre-'67 war, eh? So then there would be another impasse & more terror rockets etc. The video lives on. What is needed is Israel's right to exist declared from all Arab/Muslim nations at the start in exchange for settlement activity to cease. Then the rest is barter & negotiation.
Well i am not in a postion to know anything about what the details of a final agreement should be. I agree that Muslim nations in the ME should recognize Israel's right to exist. I believe that most of them, with the exception of Hamas, Hisbola, and Iran have done that. Nerveless making that a precondition to negotiations would seem like a non starter.
... as is stopping the settlements.! The Palestinians have given basically nothing except periodically stopping the rockets. The suicide bombers have been stopped by the walls.
Seth says
MR 2009-06-03 15:25:51 11938
seth 2009-06-03 15:13:02 11938
MR 2009-06-03 14:55:53 11938
If you follow 12047 's one sided propaganda you would think there is something going on in a tit for tat. OTOH, if you look at the background in the video you might wonder why anyone would like to live in a land that looks like a desert of a pile or rocks. It reminds me a little of the cartoon Finding Nemo & the seagulls all shouting mine mine mine mine....
What does "something going on in a tit for tat" refer to? Please note that settlements furnish an excuse for terrorism, but terrorism does not furnish a excuse for settlements.
Btw, there is not suppose to be any "one sided propaganda" included in the body of 12047 and if you see any, please call it to my attention. That item is, however, a single topic item. Only information and views directly bearing on that item are to be included. I do think such a focus is useful, but it does not imply that i think this the only problem in the West Bank.
Btw, there is not suppose to be any "one sided propaganda" included in the body of 12047 and if you see any, please call it to my attention. That item is, however, a single topic item. Only information and views directly bearing on that item are to be included. I do think such a focus is useful, but it does not imply that i think this the only problem in the West Bank.
Israel is fighting for it's life. That's still something that we here in the ivory tower in the US can't really imagine. Netanyahu believes that having outposts in the West bank at least provide some bit of strategic leverage. I have watched him on CNN & FOXNEWS & believe him to be a reasonable man with the fate & security of Israel as his top priority agenda. Obama should have the US as his! The tone of your video seemed one-sided to me.
The purpose of the settlements are not as military outposts. This is the first i have heard such a notion. These are civilian apartments. Their purpose is to have somewhere to live. There is a stratagy, all right, and that is so that when, as, and if there in a vote, there will be more Israelis voting in an area than Palestinians.
Mark de LA says
Ayatollah Ali Khamenei is perhaps the biggest stumbling block to Mideast peace.
source: ...
TEHRAN (Reuters) - Iran's supreme leader said on Thursday the United States was deeply hated in the Middle East and told U.S. President Barack Obama that "beautiful" speeches alone would not improve its image in the Muslim world.
Speaking on the same day Obama was due to give a major speech to the Islamic world in Cairo, Ayatollah Ali Khamenei said the hatred felt towards America could not be changed with "slogans" but that different U.S. action was needed.
...
Mark de LA says
Seth asks in 12047 - Will Obama be successful in stopping the growth of Jewish settlements? I say that is a wrong & one-sided question. It is one-sided in that it asks nothing of the Palestinians. It is the wrong question in that the question has not been answered, which comes first, Will Obama be successful in getting both sides , both Israel & Palestine, to acknowledge each other's right to exist & live in peace and the rest of the World, particularly the Arab & Muslim countries, to acknowledge the same thing.
Although in Obama's 6000 word speech yesterday in Egypt he declared such a right has anything new happened to move it forward in a concrete way except words?
Seth says
MR 2009-06-04 13:36:49 11938
Seth asks in 12047 - Will Obama be successful in stopping the growth of Jewish settlements? I say that is a wrong & one-sided question. It is one-sided in that it asks nothing of the Palestinians. It is the wrong question in that the question has not been answered, which comes first, Will Obama be successful in getting both sides , both Israel & Palestine, to acknowledge each other's right to exist & live in peace and the rest of the World, particularly the Arab & Muslim countries, to acknowledge the same thing.
Although in Obama's 6000 word speech yesterday in Egypt he declared such a right has anything new happened to move it forward in a concrete way except words?
I do see your point. However, 12047 has a very limited scope. It is not designed to ask a broad question about the causes and paths to peace. Rather i have an interest in tracking just this one issue. Other items can be devoted to tracking other issues. Today Obama gave a pretty good overview of all the issues including the ones you mention above. I pasted the text of everything he said about the Israel/Palestine problem in a comment on 12047, so that you would not have hunt for it. Was there anything he left out?
Mark de LA says
Well, you are tracking a side issue in a rather large complexity. What Obama left out is where any action gets taken or any substantive change in the road map proposed previously by Bush & previously by Clinton, or how the talks get restarted in earnest.
Seth says
MR 2009-06-04 14:33:39 11938
Well, you are tracking a side issue in a rather large complexity. What Obama left out is where any action gets taken or any substantive change in the road map proposed previously by Bush & previously by Clinton, or how the talks get restarted in earnest.
Well i happen to think that is is not merely "a side issue" but rather a central issue. Another comparable central issue is, as you and Obama have pointed out, Palestinian terrorism. I'm not surprised that this unilateral speech announced no substantive change. I suspect we will hear about talks getting restarted in earnest from the parties themselves after behind the scenes arm twisting has had time to play out. At least the US cards are clearly and publically on the table.
Netanyahu has said "Freezing settlements would not be reasonable" ... that is in direct opposition to Obama's "It is time for these settlements to stop." Something has to give ... something has to change that ... something in Israel ... or something given to Israel. Perhaps a whole year of zero terriorism. I don't know what, of if, it will be ... but 12047 will be watching for it.
Netanyahu has said "Freezing settlements would not be reasonable" ... that is in direct opposition to Obama's "It is time for these settlements to stop." Something has to give ... something has to change that ... something in Israel ... or something given to Israel. Perhaps a whole year of zero terriorism. I don't know what, of if, it will be ... but 12047 will be watching for it.
Mark de LA says
~ sums it up
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