Thought, Feeling & Will + Consciousness

On the human stage appears thoughts, feelings & the will along with that pesky thing we call consciousness. None of these can you haul into a laboratory & put under a microscope. None can you even grasp & put in an experimental vice at all! To be sure you can put a human brain or limb or heart in a MRI or CAT scan, but you have to resort to the imagination to come up with a explanation & connection between what you see on an MRI & what you call a thought, feeling or a manifestation of the will (or that pesky thing we call consciousness).

These are as illusive as the past, present & future which, while we have words for them, are only effects of change or extrapolations of wishes & fears (the future).

My point is this: we expect in vain that the common five senses that we have are sufficient to unveil the soul & spirit. These common five senses have evolved in the physical world. The organs to perceive & grasp the soul & spirit live in the world of thoughts, feelings & the will. We are most conscious in our thoughts, less in our feelings & almost asleep in our will. I say this because while we are conscious that we have these, we are not conscious of how they happen or evolve within our experience. We can cause individual things to happen that will result in some of the common five senses being stimulated. On the other hand, very few of us can grab a thought, feeling or intend the will toward a particular end; grasping it by the balls or shake it , sculpture it, bend & break it till it satisfies our sense of ego.

I say when we look for the spiritual & the soul we have to look in places such as these!

Comments

Seth says

Well i agree that the five senses have evolved in the "physical world" and that it is difficult to "grab a thought, feeling or intend the will toward a particular end". But i deney that it is useful to explain these actions by resorting to the historical habit of inventing the "spiritual & the soul". Perhaps these things ... these thoughts feelings and actions ... are not "grabbable" in the manner that you expect; perhaps satisfying your "sense of ego" is a catagory error, or just some mis-tagged items in your upbringing.

Seth says

Mark 2005-12-07 08:51:23 1421

"sense of ego", a particular sense in the consciousness soul, is a reality. I can find it & I have it. No amount of your mentography or tagging is going to remove it nor wish it away no matter how much materialism you chose to embrace

Well i am sure that you "do something" when you "sense your ego". What makes you so sure that others do that same thing ?

Mark de LA says
I have run into those who do. (;-))

Seth says

Mark 2005-12-07 09:00:17 1421

I have run into those who do. (;-))

... err, then how do you know that these are not just habits that are socially reinforced by the group you run in

Mark de LA says
There is also a sense for another's ego or consciousness as well ! (;-)) Which I also have & have identified.

Mark de LA says

Mark 2005-12-07 09:11:23 1421

Is the sense of sound just a habit that is socially reinforced by a group you have run into ?

Anyway, I discovered it when I was alone.

Seth says

Mark 2005-12-07 09:12:29 1421

Mark 2005-12-07 09:11:23 1421

Is the sense of sound just a habit that is socially reinforced by a group you have run into ?

Anyway, I discovered it when I was alone.

That doesn't imply much of anything. You learn lots of behaviors that manifest when you are alone. Don't forget that your senses evolved to cope with survival issues and mundane objects, not introspecting into private behaviors. As you introspect private behaviors, you are in an area of chaotic phenomena ... you imply knowledge from that chaos at your own risk ... it is very much akin to just imagining something that you want to happen.

Mark de LA says
Possibly IN YOUR CASE it's imagination or something else. My discovery does NOT require anybody to believe it or NOT - not even your esteemed self. It's more of a direct experience outside of cognition. It is something like intuition, but really no discription is useful to another person.

Seth says

Mark 2005-12-07 11:47:13 1421

Possibly IN YOUR CASE it's imagination or something else. My discovery does NOT require anybody to believe it or NOT - not even your esteemed self. It's more of a direct experience outside of cognition. It is something like intuition, but really no discription is useful to another person.

Well that's just my point: if it is not useful, then why bother? What is the use of this spiritual world? In my experience, it's only use is for one person to feel better, or more capable, than another person; and that is exactly how you are using it here in this dialogue.

Mark de LA says

"In the country of the blind the one-eyed man is king." - H.G. Wells Country of the Blind
Descriptions are useless to another just because it is impossible to describe - when discovered words fail adequately to convey it. It is pretty useless. On the other hand is is a true subjective experience. The Latin word ego (I am) said by me is good for me & no other. Remember that art is pretty useless until it is sold for money.

Mark de LA says

source:

In my experience, it's only use is for one person to feel better, or more capable, than another person; and that is exactly how you are using it here in this dialogue.

Indeed! You speak for yourself. You brought up the subject. The experience of thought, feeling & will seem to be in another world other than the strictly material.

Winnie says

seth 2005-12-07 08:58:09 1421

Mark 2005-12-07 08:51:23 1421

Well i am sure that you "do something" when you "sense your ego". What makes you so sure that others do that same thing ?

If you are taking a poll Seth! I also sense mine as well as experience it.

Winnie says

Mark 2005-12-07 12:09:41 1421

source:

In my experience, it's only use is for one person to feel better, or more capable, than another person; and that is exactly how you are using it here in this dialogue.

Indeed! You speak for yourself. You brought up the subject. The experience of thought, feeling & will seem to be in another world other than the strictly material.

Perhaps Seth its like your blindness to colors ... You can not appreciate or respect it because you do not detect it. You have a habit of living without detecting or experiencing it. Yet it is a glorious experience for those who do. It is not about feeling above another human who does not have that ability. Actually It makes me sad that you can not share in it. It is rewarding in its own context. Is self mastry rewarding? "Usefull" ?......There are numerous things that you do not detect that are usefull and even necessary. You can probably make quite a list of them if you apply yourself.

Sorry you do not experience these things

Thought, Feeling & Will + Consciousness

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