Threefold in the World

In electricity the 3 perpendicular directions show the relationship between forces
& it looks like this:

In politics the thumb (salt direction) can be Equality; the index finger can be Liberty (quicksilver direction); & the middle finger can be Fraternity (the sulfur direction).
I use the alchemical directions of space because they fit most easily the triads:

Q J X
salt quicksilver sulfur
thought feeling will
spirit soul body
form life consciousness
past present future
melody harmony rhythm
measure weight number
spiritual psychic somatic
equality liberty fraternity
up/down forward/back left/right
faith hope charity
culture rights economy
medicine law  
education political  
I think i have them right - i will adjust if something doesn't work. The yellow columns map to the spheres.  Thus economy maps to brotherhood (fraternity). Rights, the law & politics maps to liberty. Finally culture, religion medicine & education maps to equality.

Tags

  1. threefoldness
  2. triads

Comments


Mark de LA says

There are three kinds of logic: (1) the part is less than the whole (2) the part = the whole (3) the part is greater than the whole; corresponding to fraternity, equality & liberty, etc.
From the Tai Shu commentary P.2767 (paraphrased)  - the latter (3) is congruent with the meaning of Common Logic's a synergy of individuals motto.

 

.... holism & the parable of the fishes & the loves of bread inform a threefoldness birthplace for a new economy.


Mark de LA says
NB.  The above comment is not necessarily congruent with the matrix as created.

Mark de LA says
There was a time when the human brain was considered to be composed of 3 brains: the cerebrum, cerebellum & the medulla oblongata.  It's a bit more complex since science has advanced a bit in mapping it & taking it apart. cf http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_brain


Mark de LA says
In algebra it only makes sense that the whole = the sum of all it's parts. Obviously GW was thinking in some kind of metaphor.   I now think I have it correct. You only have to get 2 out of three correct & the third falls in place. Whether it is useful is another thingy.


Mark de LA says
seth 2011-06-13 09:30:37 15300
Mark 2011-06-11 08:51:55 15300
NB.  The above comment is not necessarily congruent with the matrix as created.
Ho so?
I have to figure out how fraternity maps to the the part is less than the whole. My intuition, understanding the parable like a PJ2 potluck dinner thinks that the part is < the whole is counter-intuitive.  OTOH, maybe I just figured it out. What do you think, Seth?


Seth says
MR 2011-06-13 14:41:07 15300
seth 2011-06-13 09:30:37 15300
Mark 2011-06-11 08:51:55 15300
NB.  The above comment is not necessarily congruent with the matrix as created.
Ho so?
I have to figure out how fraternity maps to the the part is less than the whole. My intuition, understanding the parable like a PJ2 potluck dinner thinks that the part is < the whole is counter-intuitive.  OTOH, maybe I just figured it out. What do you think, Seth?

Thing is "the whloe is equal to the sum of it's parts" is only true within the context of a operation which values: V=ValueOf(x), and an operation which sums: S=SumOf(x,y), and a domain like numbers where the certain axioms are always true.  Usually you don't have that situation.   So let us say you have the value to something of some action taken by some brother,  and another brother does an action too  ... well put those actions together and mathematical logic will tell you nothing about both values taken together. 

In general i would say that if you have isolated things and combine them in some useful manner you have more than you started with ... well, yeah, you have the what the things do together that they could not do alone. 

So synergy does not pose any kind of logical contradiction whatsoever. 

There certainly is synergy in the economic domain,  but i don't see any reason it is not in the other two domains as well.  Synergy just says to me that if you combine processess, you get not only the benefit of the individual processes, but you also get the benefit of the processess working together.  That can apply to thoughts, to feelings, and to actions.  

Seth says
Well .... hmmm .... ....

 equality  liberty  fraternity
 model {A + B = Whole} reality
 model {A + B > Whole } reality
 model {A + B < whole} reality
 thought  feeling  will
Interpertation: with exact thinking the meta models in your algebra exactly describe reality
Interpertation: we are free to feel and dream and go beyond what actually  exists
Interpertation:  yet reality goes beyond your wildest dreams.  Your actions synergize with others to make more than you though of.

Here i put the model part, the meta and abstractions, the dreams and imaginings on the left side of the equation - on the right i represent what is real, what actually is and is not just imagined (from the subjective point of view of one consciousness, of course). 

As you can see there are lots of ways to do this, to form a gestalt, and imho none are right or wrong.  So in that way there is just the arbitrary freedom of choice that we grant to our art: we are painting a picture, we are not precisely describing a thing.

So fraternity can be made to fit into a parallel gestalt of triads.  But this effort notwistanding, me thinks, the gestalt in these triads cannot not (should not) be treated in parallel - but rather just as separate triads.  There are several  other parallel associations in your table that go tilt, at least in my mind.

Mark de LA says
MR 2011-06-15 06:40:59 15300
... & then there is geometry which has parallel lines that meet see affine & projective geometry.

... that is to say that there are different kinds of geometry as well as different kinds of logic. These are examples of non-Euclidian geomety.

Mark de LA says
Nice work, Seth!  I would like to know which ones make you go tilt?  OTOH, from the facebook page on this subject I discovered yesterday:
source: ... It is also not too good an idea to get hung up too much with triads. Wikipedia has an interesting article on Hendiatris here: http://bit.ly/97SaBn ... & then there is another famous triple: LIFE, LIBERTY & the PERSUIT of HAPPINESS. The one we used in the logo for the group so far was used by the French Revolution. (;-))
... the ones that make sense for the context we are using are: body, soul & spirit; fraternity, liberty & equality & will, feeling & thought.   Using the triads (or triplets) helps deconfuse all the moving parts in society. Otherwise, like those in government, the tendency is to form rigid structures from the top-down.
In the context of the quoted section above it would be interesting to contemplate what the unity that the threefold (metaphor, meme, hendiatris) is trying to convey.



Mark de LA says
From Paracelsus via the Wikipedia:
Source: ...

Paracelsus believed in the Greek concept of the four elements, but he also introduced the idea that, on another level, the cosmos is fashioned from three spiritual substances: the tria prima of mercury, sulfur, and salt. These substances were not the simple substances we recognise today, but were rather broad principles that gave every object both its inner essence and outward form. Mercury represented the transformative agent (fusibility and volatility); sulfur represented the binding agent between substance and transformation (flammability); and salt represented the solidifying/substantiating agent (fixity and noncombustibility). For example, when a piece of wood is burnt, the products reflect its constitution: smoke reflects mercury, flame reflects sulfur, and ash reflects salt.[3]

The tria prima also defined the human identity. Sulfur embodied the soul, (the emotions and desires); salt represented the body; mercury epitomised the spirit (imagination, moral judgment, and the higher mental faculties). By understanding the chemical nature of the tria prima, a physician could discover the means of curing disease.

..... I like the burning wood analogy.


Mark de LA says
MR 2011-06-13 14:41:07 15300
seth 2011-06-13 09:30:37 15300
Mark 2011-06-11 08:51:55 15300
NB.  The above comment is not necessarily congruent with the matrix as created.
Ho so?
I have to figure out how fraternity maps to the the part is less than the whole. My intuition, understanding the parable like a PJ2 potluck dinner thinks that the part is < the whole is counter-intuitive.  OTOH, maybe I just figured it out. What do you think, Seth?

To a certain extent when you work for the whole you subjugate your own ego for the sake of the whole.  I think that's what it's about.


Mark de LA says
MR 2013-01-28 07:33:41 15300

Relating it all to imagination, inspiration & intuition via facebook. (GA296 - RS)

Seth says
NOW as Mental, Body-internal, & World Outside - ~~ Salt, Quicksilver, Sulfur .  If I honor my word as self (an Erhardism) How do I do that in each of the domains in this triad?

devolved out of a silence exercise in which I wanted all realms to be silent.  I chose to give my word in each, but it was an interesting journey.

Mark de LA says
Logos, Pathos, Ethos ~ Q,J,X  - Art would be Pathos - the Feeling Domain.

Seth says
... so you have the following  mapping,  thinking:logos, feeling:pathos, doing:ethos  ?  i just want to clarify.

Mark de LA says
seth 2014-04-03 07:37:25 15300
... so you have the following  mapping,  thinking:logos, feeling:pathos, doing:ethos  ?  i just want to clarify.
pretty much in the context of persuasion.  Aristotle apparently had more to say in Rhetoric- an analysis is here in a Google book. I like the term uncovered called enthymeme. (perhaps the GIGO phenomena of syllogisms)


Mark de LA says
More here on Aristotle's Rhetoric.

Einaiam says
I am still pondering the three domains as they relate to the hand or any 3-pronged triad. I woke up this AM with the idea that rather than an analysis approach, i.e. taking apart what already exists that another approach would be a synthesis approach.  Thus if the hand represents the Liberty, Equality, Fraternity triad then we can think of all those things for which freedom-liberty must be a fundamental principle i.e.
  • speech, writing, association ... (essentially the first amendment to the US Constitution)
  • the soul is free to experience whatever it desires bearing in mind the consequences.
  • art
  • healing
  • learning & education
  • etc.

As far as brotherhood goes - the domain of economics mainly

  • nobility of vocation
  • commonwealth
  • dynamic equilibrium of goods & services within ..
  • an ecology that is aware of gaia & yet not dominated by "global" politics
  • etc.

As far as equality goes - essentially the rights domain (& politics -law)

  • we are all equal before the law
  • money & economics must not be a concern
  • get the law out of business
  • get the money out of business
  • get the money out of government
  • get the money out of elections
  • we are all equal in terms of our vote
  • etc

Other triads could be invented to power threefoldness such as culture, rights & economy but they seem more abstract to me.


Seth says
Einaiam 2014-10-11 07:20:04 15300
What talk tab?

i was refering to the "talk tab" in the Wikipedia article .... which takes you to this page which informs you of "the process by which this description is evolving.   Personally i have a lot of respect for the Wikipedia process and i really like the effect that they produce.  It is a process in which even we can participate.

Seth says
Einaiam 2014-10-11 07:11:11 15300
seth 2014-10-11 07:03:57 15300
Is this an open group, if so why is the password not "threefold society", if not then why not?
It is fine as is. Read the header.

kewl,

Seth says
Einaiam 2014-10-11 07:52:15 15300
seth 2014-10-11 07:34:12 15300
Einaiam 2014-10-11 07:20:04 15300
What talk tab?

i was refering to the "talk tab" in the Wikipedia article .... which takes you to this page which informs you of "the process by which this description is evolving.   Personally i have a lot of respect for the Wikipedia process and i really like the effect that they produce.  It is a process in which even we can participate.
It is very tiny .
Reading some of the neutrality stuff I fear it will be no better than some of our argumentation, but I am open to vancing into some of it as I get a

ok ... i just wanted you to become aware, if you were not already, of the process by which this article happened.  many times when i read a wikipedia article and have some question about something in it, i can tab over to the discussion and figure out the source and thinking behind what is said in the article.  

Einaiam says
I once wrote in CyberMind that the division of the fruits of labor has components which are different for different groupings of people, viz..
  1. family - equal distribution
  2. capital investors - proportional to investment
  3. vocational labor - according to production (not time-clocked)
  4. management - according to integrity & results (needs fleshing out)
  5. inventors & creators - according to the market
  6. tbd

needs a lot of fleshing out - the original is in deep - deep archive on a very old Amiga compatable hard drive.


Mark de LA says

In the mean while may you dwell in the somatic fraternity, psychic liberty & spiritual equality which achieves the Great Work!" P.2470 of the tai shu


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