The Trayvon Martin Killing

***
It is hard to get the rev Sharpton & the usual suspects out for these: (the original title now changed)
http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/teenagers-poured-gasoline-boy-walking-home-school-set-fire-cops-article-1.1033062

http://articles.philly.com/2012-01-30/news/31006014_1_cabbie-face-hate-crime-charges-three-teens
.. true a murder was involved in the one below though & the president himself is churning it up!  Funny I noticed in one account the shooter was labeled as a white Hispanic (for what reason?).  See the drudge page this morning:
Before going off half-cocked again read the whole article on the recently published evidence.

Tags

  1. racism
  2. race card
  3. caldron
  4. trayvon martin
  5. news fronts
  6. hoodie
  7. zimmerman
  8. zimmerbashing
  9. sorry
  10. attention hound
  11. mf

Comments


Mark de LA says
Timeline from Google News:

Timeline of articles

Timeline of articles
Number of sources covering this story
Gingrich, Romney, Santorum discuss Trayvon Martin
‎12 minutes ago‎ - CBS News
Sanford police chief 'temporarily' steps down
‎22 hours ago‎ - CNN (blog)
Trayvon Martin Shooting Outrage Comes to House Floor
‎Mar 22, 2012‎ - ABC News (blog)
Rep. Wilson: Trayvon's death is 'murder'
‎Mar 22, 2012‎ - msnbc.com
'Stand Your Ground Law' at center of Fla. shooting
‎Mar 22, 2012‎ - The Associated Press
Trayvon Martin's slaying rivets nation
‎Mar 21, 2012‎ - Washington Post
Trayvon Martin Case: Timeline of Events
‎Mar 21, 2012‎ - ABC News (blog)
Sanford, Florida, police answer questions about teen's shooting death
‎Mar 21, 2012‎ - CNN (blog)
Neighborhood watch leader may have uttered racial slur before shooting
‎Mar 21, 2012‎ - Fox News
Trayvon Martin case: 16-year-old girl recalls last phone conversation minutes ...
‎Mar 20, 2012‎ - New York Daily News


Mark de LA says
The timeline x-ed out above is:
for google travon martin

Mark de LA says
The incident took 26 days & the newsfront is reaching maximum strength (hopefully): probably this weekend.
source: ... The 16-year-old told Martin's family attorney she was on the phone with Martin on the night of Feb. 26, ABC News reported, and they talked just moments before he was shot to death by George Zimmerman.

Read more: http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/trayvon-martin-case-16-year-old-girl-recalls-phone-conversation-minutes-martin-shot-dead-report-article-1.1047445#ixzz1pxyd6qpA
...


Mark de LA says
PREDICTION: The Wheels of Justice will turn just as fast & just as slow as necessary to produce amazing headlines for an October surprise.  Considering jobs & the economy, Obama has done pretty much nothing for his favorite identity group - the blacks. He needs to shore up that one with a punctuation mark. A nice long hot Summer may take attention away from the economy, spending & bankrupting, jobs, Iran, wars, & government corruption (Solyndra, Chevy Volt, Pipeline to nowhere, etc.) for his re-election.

He must reassure the voters that there is still something left in him that warrants a trust in his government:

Mark de LA says
& here Jeb Bush says that the "Stand Your Ground" law does not apply http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2012/03/24/republican-leaders-express-sympathy-support-stand-your-ground/


Seth says
seth 2012-03-24 08:28:26 15904
source: M above
I take the rest of your account as coloratura.
Yep, that is exactly what it was.  Of late i have been getting into fashion.  Hoodies are in vogue ... and not just for hoodlums ... Gerando's bloviations notwithstanding.
... and with this picture, i rest my case...



Mark de LA says
MR 2012-03-23 12:38:30 15904
FYI, on the long hot summer thingy:

NEWSFLASH! "If I had a son, he'd look like Trayvon,"

Mark de LA says
seth 2012-03-23 15:19:41 15904
FYI here is a reasonable exposition of the facts in the case.   According to the AP story "It was raining, and Martin was walking with the hood of his jacket pulled over his head".  Consequently Geraldo's comments are even more ridiculous than i had though.  But i guess from that all we can really conclude is that Geraldo has no sense of fashion ... or for that matter how to practically get out  of the rain.

The facts are about the same in all reports I have read so far. FYI, I never use Geraldo as a primary source for anything. He is occasionally amusing. Strange you kinda lead with that. I take the rest of your account as coloratura.  It's all a depends upon your point of view.


Mark de LA says
I was wrong . . . the newsfront was just getting started: Drudge:


'You ain't tell me you swung on a bus driver'...

New details emerge on Trayvon...

Multiple suspensions from school: marijuana, grafitti, 'possession of burglary tool,' jewelry...

House Dems to bring parents to Capitol Hill...

COPS: Zimmerman says Trayvon decked him with one blow, hammered head on sidewalk...

'Suffered broken nose and had injury to back of head'...

Former NAACP leader accuses Sharpton, Jackson of 'exploiting' death...

Mother seeks to trademark dead son's name...

'Cracker' T-shirt hits Florida streets...

Mark de LA says
What is this?
  • Rush to judgement?
  • Community organizing - community action?
  • The usual race-baiting ? Something for Sharpton-Jackson to do?
  • The beginning of a long hot Summer?
  • Beginning of a "Black" Spring?
  • Hispanic vs Black?
  • Tribal behavior & exploitation?
  • Something else?

I'm just asking?


Mark de LA says
MR 2012-03-27 07:55:04 15904
  • Perhaps a mondern lynching?
source: ... The separatist New Black Panther Party, described as a hate group by a civil rights organization, is standing by its $10,000 bounty offer for the capture of the man who shot Trayvon Martin, despite vehement opposition from, among others, Martin's family.
...

Fascinating the newsfronty keeps on giving just like a venerial disease:
http://dailycaller.com/2012/03/26/the-daily-caller-obtains-trayvon-martins-tweets/#ixzz1qGztV3LT Trayvon had a twitter handle “NO_LIMIT_NIGGA,” ????


Mark de LA says
seth 2012-03-27 09:40:05 15904
MR 2012-03-27 09:05:36 15904
MR 2012-03-27 07:55:04 15904
  • Perhaps a mondern lynching?
source: ... The separatist New Black Panther Party, described as a hate group by a civil rights organization, is standing by its $10,000 bounty offer for the capture of the man who shot Trayvon Martin, despite vehement opposition from, among others, Martin's family.
...

Fascinating the newsfronty keeps on giving just like a venerial disease:

Apparently your side of the consciousness fight has settled on character assignation of the victim .
Nope! Not Even - just plucking shit out of the news!  Got something different? Post it.


Mark de LA says
I thought it would have gone away until it resurged even worse this AM on Drudge:

'SO MUCH HATE COMING FROM THE PRESIDENT'...
George Zimmerman's father speaks for first time...
Says Trayvon Martin threatened to kill his son...
'You're going to die tonight'...
ABCNEWS: Police video shows no blood on Zimmerman...
Large gash on back of head?
POLICE REPORT: Bleeding from nose, head...
Network names 13-year-old witness!
'Plzz shoot da #mf dat lied 2 u!'
Parents of murdered Brit students slam Obama...
@KILLZIMMERMAN TWITTER feed...


@KillZimmerman    


Mark de LA says
The police video of Zimmerman is the one that interests me.  CNN explains it as the cops did first aid in the squad car & cleaned him up a bit. His father said his nose was broken - don't know how it may have been verified.  This is an excellent case for discussion in group UnhackTheBrain


Mark de LA says
Question - would the existence of a reliable facts only event database as I have detailed elsewere avoid the mob mentality of the news front we have right now?

Seth says
One of the actual pieces of evidence was this 911 call that has not gotten much coverage ...


______________________________________________

Trayvon's mother said that was Travon yelling "Help".  Why would an aggressor be yelling help?   It is hard not to conclude that Trayvon was fighting for his life. 


Mark de LA says
If Zimmerman were the one yelling for HELP then why would the agressor Travon be yelling?  The shadow cast in many directions, eh?


Seth says
MR 2012-03-29 15:57:39 15904
If Zimmerman were the one yelling for HELP then why would the agressor Travon be yelling?  The shadow cast in many directions, eh?


What evidence do you have that the aggressor was Trayvon?

The shouts sound like they are coming from a young person under extreme stress.  Trayvon's mother also identified her son's voice on the call.  So there is scant reason to believe that Zimmerman was the one yelling.

I do think it is reasonable to assume that the person yelling was NOT the aggressor.  Also the yelling stopped immediately after the shot was fired ... indicated that the yeller was no longer capable of yelling. 

Seth says
All the usual commentators from the right are bloviating today about how "Zimmerman is being tried in the press".   Which i say is a grand hypocritical misdirection .... were the criminal justice system have worked in this case, there would already be a trial scheduled where facts could be determined by a jury.  It is because of the lack of that trial, we have the current awareness. 

Mark de LA says
Racists continue to make it a race war (black v. hispanic?) :



Hoodie-Wearing Gunmen Kill 1, Wound 5 in Bobby Rush's District...

'There were young men scattered everywhere'...


Mark de LA says
Some people missed the part where the state attorney is/has convening grand jury & special prosecutor etc. Apparently there are people who want a race war instead of waiting for the results.
Those closest to gangs, mobs & tribal behavior would rather play the race card & lynch'em in the media.


Mark de LA says
NO LEADERSHIP FROM THE WHITE HOUSE THOUGH!


Mark de LA says
Inciting riots & violence? http://www.schnittshow.com/cc-common/news/sections/newsarticle.html?feed=454847&article=9976302
What about the New Black Panthers & the bounty thingy - kidnapping?


Mark de LA says
seth 2012-03-30 16:48:10 15904
Drudge and/or you associate things that have no relationship to each other.  
So are the race-bating poverty pimps of Sharpton's ilk!


Mark de LA says
Go back to the hoodie wearing congressman referenced above & actually read the article.


Seth says
MR 2012-03-31 10:17:41 15904
seth 2012-03-31 10:13:54 15904
MR 2012-03-30 21:49:47 15904
seth 2012-03-30 17:43:35 15904
MR 2012-03-30 17:24:13 15904
seth 2012-03-30 16:48:10 15904
Drudge and/or you associate things that have no relationship to each other.  
So are the race-bating poverty pimps of Sharpton's ilk!

I don't know how you come up with that.   All i am saying is that you and/or drudge seem to have mis-associated Sharpton's BS with a shooting in Chicago.
Something about hoodies in the article if I remember.

Oh i get it ... it's a cluster of awareness about hoodies.   How about this site, shouldn't we incude this one as well?
WOW you didn't seem to digest the article on rep. Bobby Rush's appearance in Congress well at all.!

Yep, more clustered hoodie incidents.  That is unless you are trying to imply some casual relationship between Bobby Rush's speech in congress and the shootings ... but, no, i doubt that even you would make that kind of association. 

Look, just for the record,  i think that Sharpton, as usual, is over reacting in the extreme and is liable to spawn more harm than justice.  That said, you can pay attention to just what you want to tune into.  Me i am still outraged at the miscarriage of justice and hope that Florida sets that right and we have a trial.  Sans this public awareness ... he would get off Scot free. 

Mark de LA says
seth 2012-03-31 10:13:54 15904
MR 2012-03-30 21:49:47 15904
seth 2012-03-30 17:43:35 15904
MR 2012-03-30 17:24:13 15904
seth 2012-03-30 16:48:10 15904
Drudge and/or you associate things that have no relationship to each other.  
So are the race-bating poverty pimps of Sharpton's ilk!

I don't know how you come up with that.   All i am saying is that you and/or drudge seem to have mis-associated Sharpton's BS with a shooting in Chicago.
Something about hoodies in the article if I remember.

Oh i get it ... it's a cluster of awareness about hoodies.   How about this site, shouldn't we incude this one as well?
WOW you didn't seem to digest the article on rep. Bobby Rush's appearance in Congress well at all.!


Mark de LA says
Sometimes the unexpected shows up:


Mark de LA says
Some say that the outrage had to wait for the War Against Women news front to pass before it could get started to give Obama some needed support from his black base.
RUSH: ...

RUSH: I understand that. That's reprehensible. Look, there's nothing in this story to get happy about on any side. The problem is there are people who are. That's sort of what's disgusting, Betty, is that there are some people really excited about this because of the opportunity it presents. It's despicable if you ask me, the way -- you're right, it happens five weeks ago now, it lies dormant for three weeks 'til the media finishes with their war on women. Then all of a sudden they shift gears to go into this. It's all about Obama's reelection, pure and simple. And until Obama or Jackson or Sharpton lead them to a story, the media's not gonna go there on something like this, 'cause it's all about protecting or building up Obama. And that's gonna be going on the whole remainder of the year.

Now, Trayvon Martin, he was killed 60 feet from his house. Where were his neighbors? Unrecognized or unknown or whatever for three days in the morgue, that's despicable. This story is doing more harm to the black community than anything else out there right now. There's nothing that is uplifting or admirable. Nothing about this portends good. Just a shame, all the way around. And now with what the media's doing, what NBC has done with the doctoring of this 911 call, that's beyond the pale. It's an attempt to inflame. It's an attempt to spread hate. It's an attempt to influence a criminal investigation with lies and distortions. It's reprehensible. It's not doing anybody any good.


...

Mark de LA says
seth 2012-04-02 15:29:14 15904
You miss the point.  It is not my own knowledge that is at question here ... sure i can wait ... i have but prurient interest in the case anyway. 

The point is that ... "sans the collective outrage, there never would have been a grand jury or a trial of any sorts".  The case had already been closed.  It was only reopened because of the efforts of the family and the subsequent media and public outcry. 
So you've figured out how to go back in time & prove what would happen in the present. Kewl! Work on that with the Super Lotto & share some with me!
 

Seth says
MR 2012-04-02 12:56:58 15904
seth 2012-04-02 11:22:32 15904
MR 2012-04-02 10:32:26 15904
seth 2012-04-02 10:23:00 15904
I'm sure you're gonna want to crawl on this ... my only counsel is not to get too caught up with siding against the mob ... that is just one side of the coin of awareness of the event.  Remember how you finger felt jamming into my nose?  Did you get any snot on it?  Did you get a chance to wipe it off?

Fuck the mob - fuck it UP the ASS! Fuck the wives & sons of the mob - Fuck them up the ASS!  .... Lets have lynchings as far as the eye can see. Armageddon onward. Maybe the 12th Imam will save you all.  Not me! I don't want to live in a World ruled by the power of mobs.  "Give me Liberty or Give me Death" -P.H.
Oh ok ... do you prefer living in a world where a citizen can provoke a fight with an unarmed boy and kill him with impunity?

We do not know for sure that your narrative has ANY truth in it at ALL! If you prefer a mob to the process & rule of law my comments stand! You are certainly not a good judge yourself being prisoner of the narrative which has already shown itself to be full of lies.
There are truths in the 911 tapes and eye-witness statements sufficient to send the question of guilt or innocence to a jury.  Sans the collective outcry for justice that trial would never happen.  Obviously I have no preference for mob rule over law ... nor is there anything i have said which is consistent with that speculation
... so apparently your "comments" do not stand. 

What does remain, however, is my question: "Do you prefer living in a world where a citizen can provoke a fight with an unarmed boy and kill him with impunity?" ... strangely enough i suspect you would not ... but really i am not sure ... i doubt that you have even posed the question to yourself.  But you see that is the real question which a complete understanding of this event and its aftermath must  deal with.  It is not just about the evils of mob activity.

Mark de LA says
Evidence in a court of law & before the grand jury & possibly a special prosecutor is much more robust & usually more reliable that hearsay which comes out of the M$M (Main Slut Media)! If you can't wait for the slow, but effective course of the rule of law to flow to a valid conclusion then maybe you will have to just stew in your own latrine juices anyway.  I stand where I stand & will wait.
Fuck the Mob!

Mark de LA says
seth 2012-04-02 11:22:32 15904
MR 2012-04-02 10:32:26 15904
seth 2012-04-02 10:23:00 15904
I'm sure you're gonna want to crawl on this ... my only counsel is not to get too caught up with siding against the mob ... that is just one side of the coin of awareness of the event.  Remember how you finger felt jamming into my nose?  Did you get any snot on it?  Did you get a chance to wipe it off?

Fuck the mob - fuck it UP the ASS! Fuck the wives & sons of the mob - Fuck them up the ASS!  .... Lets have lynchings as far as the eye can see. Armageddon onward. Maybe the 12th Imam will save you all.  Not me! I don't want to live in a World ruled by the power of mobs.  "Give me Liberty or Give me Death" -P.H.
Oh ok ... do you prefer living in a world where a citizen can provoke a fight with an unarmed boy and kill him with impunity?

We do not know for sure that your narrative has ANY truth in it at ALL! If you prefer a mob to the process & rule of law my comments stand! You are certainly not a good judge yourself being prisoner of the narrative which has already shown itself to be full of lies.

Mark de LA says
seth 2012-04-02 15:46:14 15904
MR 2012-04-02 15:31:33 15904
seth 2012-04-02 15:29:14 15904
You miss the point.  It is not my own knowledge that is at question here ... sure i can wait ... i have but prurient interest in the case anyway. 

The point is that ... "sans the collective outrage, there never would have been a grand jury or a trial of any sorts".  The case had already been closed.  It was only reopened because of the efforts of the family and the subsequent media and public outcry. 
So you've figured out how to go back in time & prove what would happen in the present. Kewl! Work on that with the Super Lotto & share some with me!
 
No going back in time is necessary ... the case had been closed ... it now has been reopened.  I do see how your easy denial of those "facts" will make your stance feel justified to your conscience ... but to me it just feels that you are continuing to avoid  the real issue.
... & you know "the case was closed" how? & what was the timeline with all the other things going on in the justice system?

Seth says
MR 2012-04-02 15:57:35 15904
seth 2012-04-02 15:46:14 15904
MR 2012-04-02 15:31:33 15904
seth 2012-04-02 15:29:14 15904
You miss the point.  It is not my own knowledge that is at question here ... sure i can wait ... i have but prurient interest in the case anyway. 

The point is that ... "sans the collective outrage, there never would have been a grand jury or a trial of any sorts".  The case had already been closed.  It was only reopened because of the efforts of the family and the subsequent media and public outcry. 
So you've figured out how to go back in time & prove what would happen in the present. Kewl! Work on that with the Super Lotto & share some with me!
 
No going back in time is necessary ... the case had been closed ... it now has been reopened.  I do see how your easy denial of those "facts" will make your stance feel justified to your conscience ... but to me it just feels that you are continuing to avoid  the real issue.
... & you know "the case was closed" how? & what was the timeline with all the other things going on in the justice system?

Ok, there is no evidence that the case was actually closed.   However given the fact that Zimmerman was not arrested, the responses from the police to families inquirers, and their reluctance to even turn over the 911 tapes, there is scant reason to believe that sans the public outcry, any charges would have ever been brought.  Here is good snapshot of the news when this was starting ...
source: huffingtonpost March 9th
Police in Sanford, where the shooting occurred, told Martin’s family that Zimmerman had a “squeaky-clean” record and that’s why they had not arrested him, according to Tracy Martin, the teen’s father.
...
Crump has asked law enforcement officials to turn over the 911 tapes recorded the night Martin was killed. He has since filed a public records lawsuit to get the recordings.

Bear in mind that all i am saying is that it is the public outcry that is driving this case to some kind of legitimate trial.  


Mark de LA says
The Wheels of Justice grind exceedingly slow sometimes just for things like this case. You don't want mobs to decide who is guilty & who is innocent, your strawman notwithstanding. It is a mixed blessing that judges are rarely elected. I have never voted in an election that had more than one judge for a place in the judiciary; SCOTUS not on ballot at all. Study some real civics instead of bloggers (including myself).
https://www.hillsdale.edu/constitution/login.aspx

Mark de LA says
Other than the obvious pandering to one of Obama's identity groups, I wondered why Obama said "If I had a son he would look like Trayvon" then I remembered Rules for Radicals #13
Saul Alinsky: ... 13. Pick the target, freeze it, personalize it, and polarize it.
... page 130 et seq. in the current paperback version of Alinsky's book - http://bit.ly/HVpjHM

Good job Obama!

Mark de LA says
In a town real close to where Trayvon was shot comes this one:
http://articles.orlandosentinel.com/2012-04-02/news/os-two-arrested-seminole-beating-20120402_1_victim-arrest-affidavits-crimeline
source: ...

A tip to Crimeline has led to the arrests of two men in a brutal beating that occurred a week ago in the Midway community east of Sanford.

Julius Ricardo Bender, 18, and Yahaziel Isaac Israel, 19, face charges of attempted first-degree murder, burglary with assault or battery and armed burglary.

...
Where's the outrage?


Mark de LA says
Proud of people ginning up race violence with lies, doctored tapes (NBC was exposed several days ago) ?
http://www.toledoblade.com/Police-Fire/2012/04/03/Man-78-recounts-assault-by-6-youths-in-E-Toledo.html
... some people probably are!
Boycott NBC, eh?

Mark de LA says
seth 2012-04-03 16:26:22 15904
MR 2012-04-03 14:59:57 15904
In a town real close to where Trayvon was shot comes this one:
source: ...

A tip to Crimeline has led to the arrests of two men in a brutal beating that occurred a week ago in the Midway community east of Sanford.

Julius Ricardo Bender, 18, and Yahaziel Isaac Israel, 19, face charges of attempted first-degree murder, burglary with assault or battery and armed burglary.

...
Where's the outrage?

No outrage necessary, your report says "Both men were arrested late Friday" , the criminal justice system seems to be functioning as normal.

I guess it is hard for you to understand what the problem is. 
No arrest was necessary in the self-defense case.  No racial profiling in either, eh?


Mark de LA says
Hmmm.... more context comes out. Were the police officers afraid to arrest GZ?  Was something else in play.  Does this kinda prove GZ was not a racist & in fact an anti-racist?
I hope investigation finally reveals what happened.  Meanwhile NBC did doctor the 911 tape to lead us to believe GZ was a racist or at least doing racial profiling.  Where is the MOB picketing NBC? Where are the

In late 2010 and early 2011 George Zimmerman, the Hispanic Sanford, Fla., man who shot and killed 17-year-old black teen Trayvon Martin, publicly demanded discipline in a race-related beating case for at least two of the police officers who cleared him after the Feb. 26 altercation, according to records obtained by The Daily Caller.

In a letter to Seminole County NAACP president Turner Clayton, a member of the Zimmerman family wrote that George was one of “very few” in Sanford who publicly condemned the “beating of the black homeless man Sherman Ware on Dec. 4, 2010, by the son of a Sanford police officer,” who is white.



Read more: http://dailycaller.com/2012/04/04/zimmerman-demanded-discipline-in-2010-race-related-beating-for-officers-who-investigated-martin-shooting/#ixzz1r6wQppcR
...


Mark de LA says
DRUDGE:
Special prosecutor: Won't take Trayvon Martin death to grand jury, still investigating...
....
Protest forces Sanford Police Department to close...
....
Are we getting MORE or LESS RACISM BECAUSE OF THIS EVENT & THE PROTESTS?
....
Tulsa police: Shootings may have been revenge...

NBCNEWS ON DEFENSE IN TRAYVON CASE...

Bill Cosby: 'It's The Gun'... <<<<

New Black Panthers: Time to shed some blood...

Mark de LA says
MO' DRUDGE this AM:
RACE WARS:        (IMHO RAGE GENERATES RAGE FOR THE SAKE OF RAGE MOBS ARE KINDA LIKE THAT!) ... ANYONE FOR RATIONALITY? ... it used to be called mass hysteria, now the secret ingredient is the new media and the samo-samo M$M.

White man brutally beaten after black attackers shout 'Trayvon'...

Sanford police car shot near Martin death site...



ZIMMERMAN BREAKS SILENCE...

Family challenges Holder on New Black Panthers...  <== interesting!

Mark de LA says
An amazing lack of leadership from the White House, but we do have Obama's old preacher commenting:


Rev. Wright Unleashed: 'White Supremacy' Drives 'World Policy'...

Seth says
MR 2012-04-10 18:07:31 15904
seth 2012-04-10 17:06:19 15904
MR 2012-04-10 15:52:38 15904
Apparently George Zimmerman's lawyers quit & lose contact: http://www.foxnews.com/us/2012/04/10/zimmermans-lawyers-withdraw-from-shooting-case/ 
 
Isn't there some kind of lawyers code that says "first do no harm" ? Tell me if these lawyers did Zimmerman any good by so public a withdrawal from the case coupled with showing how unstable Zimmerman actually is. Why didn't they simply keep their mouths shut? How does what they did help Zimmerman in any way. What, they don't know how to stonewall. With lawyers like this you don't need any enemies.

Which leads me to believe that these lawyers know something that they are not telling us ... because what they did tell us did not justify them making this public spectical.  Maybe they know he is fleeing prosecution, maybe they know he might well commit suicide.  I don't know ... but this press conference was an anomaly.
Maybe is a huge speculative tree of nonsense. You made a nice heap with this one. Usually lawyers withdraw from a case so as to no longer to be responsible for the outcome & to avoid being disbarred if a client does something.  In this case apparently they say GZ violated their instructions about non communication. Hannity said yesterday he talked to GZ. I didn't watch last night's show (mostly I don't). There will surely be some more on FoxNews this evening.

 ... an interesting reaction indeed ... especially in light of the discussion we had years ago around item 14043.   Where do thoughts come from?  

Me i had a instant reaction to what i called an anomalous event ... something that went tilt ... layers behaving in unexpected ways.   Strangely enough, you might have noticed that all of the talking heads on cable news expressed the same surprise and for the same reasons.   Yet, you, call it "a huge speculative tree of nonsense ...  a nice heap". 


Now where did that come from?

Seth says
i found it interesting to read the exact "capias" ...
source: BNOnews
COUNT 1: IN THE COUNTY OF SEMINOLE, STATE OF FLORIDA, on February 26, 2012, GEORGE ZIMMERMAN, did unlawfully and by an act imminently dangerous to another, and evincing a depraved mind regardless of human life, although without any premeditated design to effect the death of any particular individual, kill TRAYVON MARTIN, a human being under the age of eighteen, by shooting the said victim, and during the commission of the aforementioned Second Degree Murder, the said GEORGE ZIMMERMAN did carry, display, use, threaten to use or attempt to use a firearm and did actually possess and discharge a firearm and as a result of the discharge, death or great bodily harm was inflicted upon any person, contrary to the provisions of Section 782.04(2), 775.087(1) and 775.087(2), Florida Statutes.
...


Mark de LA says
seth 2012-04-11 10:14:19 15904
MR 2012-04-11 09:34:42 15904
Thanks for your new picture!
I don't know which event you are talking about the whole shooting or the lawyers trying to cover their own asses.  Most of what you said was imagination (stuff you hadn't witnessed or is in the future)  about the lawyers & events. Learn to know the difference & reality might set in.

I don't know, you seem to be so much into this RW Game that it's hard to get any other communication happening.  It should be obvious that i was commenting on the lawyers press conference since i was responding to your post of the URL to that news story.  You didn't know that i had watched that story live.

Now that i review my response, it is clear that i was speculating ... surly that was  what you were referring to with your "a huge speculative tree of nonsense" comment.  Perhaps you, yourself, had not noted the anomalous behavior of the lawyers, having read the story third hand ... and so it was my speculation itself that hit you as beyond the pail. 

Sometimes it's fun to track the chain of surprises, the edges, that cause responses.  Sometimes they are just a lack of attention ... sometimes they are knee-jerk responses.  That is all that i am calling your attention to.
The only genuine/neutral/question in your:
Seth (above) : ...
Isn't there some kind of lawyers code that says "first do no harm" ? Tell me if these lawyers did Zimmerman any good by so public a withdrawal from the case coupled with showing how unstable Zimmerman actually is. Why didn't they simply keep their mouths shut? How does what they did help Zimmerman in any way. What, they don't know how to stonewall. With lawyers like this you don't need any enemies.

Which leads me to believe that these lawyers know something that they are not telling us ... because what they did tell us did not justify them making this public spectical. Maybe they know he is fleeing prosecution, maybe they know he might well commit suicide. I don't know ... but this press conference was an anomaly.

... & I explained that they a lawyers first & wanted to cover their own asses.  If they release anything that the prosecution can use they can be disbarred or put in jail or both. It may be that the "hiring relationship" was not traditional counsel for the defense since GZ was not charged - more public relations (I don't know).
There's a lot of speculation space available to play in - enjoy.

Mark de LA says
First do no harm is part of the Hippocratic Oath not to be confused with Don't Be Evil of Google fame.

Mark de LA says
Thanks for your new picture!
I don't know which event you are talking about the whole shooting or the lawyers trying to cover their own asses.  Most of what you said was imagination (stuff you hadn't witnessed or is in the future)  about the lawyers & events. Learn to know the difference & reality might set in.


Seth says
MR 2012-04-11 11:17:42 15904
Apparently it is announced that GZ will be charged with something(?).
... & Michelle Williams stokes the fires of racism:
... Williams can be heard saying, "Let me tell you something, the things that is about to happen to these honkeys, these crackers, these pigs, these pink people, these (beep) people, it has been long over due."
Michelle Williams is the Chief of Staff with the local chapter of the New Black Panther Party. As a community activist, she has also worked very closely with both the Hillsborough County Sheriff's Office as well as the Tampa Police Department

Read more: http://www.abcactionnews.com/dpp/news/region_hillsborough/michelle-williams-responds-to-controversial-audio-recording-concerning-trayvon-martin-case#ixzz1rl0BMEld

...

You got it here first ... even before the news conference ...
source: AP
A law enforcement official says that the killer in the Trayvon Martin case will be charged with second-degree murder and is in custody.
... and the reaction from the family itself is in stark contrast to Michelle Williams. 



Mark de LA says
Speaking of disgrace from the rapist, x-con, ear biting Mike Tyson:


TYSON ON ZIMMERMAN: 'Disgrace he hasn't been shot yet'...

Mark de LA says
seth 2012-04-12 17:13:02 15904

Yep, not much new there.

Mark de LA says


Mark de LA says
DRUDGE AM Update:
....
Zimmerman freed, but closely watched...
Attorney apologizes for apology... (nb.  Usually a victim doesn't have an attorney in the mix - who is paying for this one ? - MR)
'Lynch mob' hits TWITTER...   (NOW we're transitioning to MOB justice?)
'Someone Kill the Judge!!!!!'   (NOW we're transitioning to MOB justice?)
...
The next time you folks applaud MOB action think about what might happen if you, yourself happen to be on the other side of the MOB!


Seth says
Imho, your drudge headlines are not really the news of today ... this it ...
source: ABC News
On day of Zimmerman's bail, police chief to resign
... Is that an admission that he was involved in letting a murder walk free with no need to defend himself in court?

I get that not from broadcast news, or even biased Internet aggregators, but rather from social media. 


Seth says
I'm beginning to think that this Trayvon tragedy is not about race at all.  It is about guns and the law. Here is a similar event which eliminates the race question entirely.   Here again the shooters were not arrested.  The solution: get rid of the laws which slant justice in favor of those who use guns ... or just get rid of the guns themselves. 

This is a bloggable insight, on fb here.

Mark de LA says
seth 2012-04-23 11:12:38 15904
Imho, your drudge headlines are not really the news of today ... this it ...
source: ABC News
On day of Zimmerman's bail, police chief to resign
... Is that an admission that he was involved in letting a murder walk free with no need to defend himself in court?

I get that not from broadcast news, or even biased Internet aggregators, but rather from social media. 

Social media is also calling for murder!  Yours is speculation - nice truthy ... nice truthy!


Mark de LA says
M 2012-04-23 12:20:39 15904
seth 2012-04-23 11:12:38 15904
Imho, your drudge headlines are not really the news of today ... this it ...
source: ABC News
On day of Zimmerman's bail, police chief to resign
... Is that an admission that he was involved in letting a murder walk free with no need to defend himself in court?

I get that not from broadcast news, or even biased Internet aggregators, but rather from social media. 

Social media is also calling for murder!  Yours is speculation - nice truthy ... nice truthy!

Had Daryl Gates known about what would have happened after the trial of the police men who beat Rodney King he probably would have resigned too. Ditto here (I speculate).  What kind of Mob & Rioting do you think will happen if Zimmerman is acquitted of all charges?


Mark de LA says
More detailed context for the neighborhood of the shooting & GZ's family. Nice detailed background material.
http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/04/25/us-usa-florida-shooting-zimmerman-idUSBRE83O18H20120425 .


Mark de LA says
seth 2012-04-25 16:01:10 15904
... what are the odds of both of us posting the same article within one minute.
44 secs!


flushmeister says
Some parties seem to be turning this case into a triangularity instead of the usual prosecutor-defense adversary trial topology.  The victim has a lawyer and is arguing his side in the media. Normally, in a criminal trial, reasonable doubt as to whether the defendant committed the crime leads to acquittal.  It doesn't mean that any number of theories about the circumstances & how it happened all have to be disproved before the defendant is considered not guilty. The prosecutor has to pick one!


Seth says
seth 2012-04-27 16:07:30 15904
seth 2012-04-27 15:51:42 15904
Well Zimmerman lied by virtue of his omission ...
source: CNN
Zimmerman collected about $204,000 in donations through the website, but did not disclose the contributions during his bond hearing last week, according to his attorney, Mark O'Mara. Prosecutors had asked for a bond of $1 million, but Judge Kenneth Lester Jr. made it $150,000 after Zimmerman's family testified they did not have the resources necessary to meet the higher level.
... so what else is he lying about?  He was let out on the small bail just because there was testimony that he was substantially indigent.


Some more context on this ...
source: talking points memo
Attorneys for Martin’s family reacted with anger on Friday, saying Zimmerman had an obligation to disclose how much money he had available when he took the witness stand last week.

“George Zimmerman raised his right hand in court and swore to tell the truth. He swore to be honest,” attorney Benjamin Crump told CNN. “He watched that whole proceeding and never once said a word to the court whether or not he had raised money on that website when he knew he had raised over $200,000. He kept claiming he was indigent so he could get a very, very low bond.”
...

The Orlando Centinal appears to be the original source of this information.

Mark de LA says
seth 2012-04-27 16:19:52 15904
seth 2012-04-27 16:07:30 15904
seth 2012-04-27 15:51:42 15904
Well Zimmerman lied by virtue of his omission ...
source: CNN
Zimmerman collected about $204,000 in donations through the website, but did not disclose the contributions during his bond hearing last week, according to his attorney, Mark O'Mara. Prosecutors had asked for a bond of $1 million, but Judge Kenneth Lester Jr. made it $150,000 after Zimmerman's family testified they did not have the resources necessary to meet the higher level.
... so what else is he lying about?  He was let out on the small bail just because there was testimony that he was substantially indigent.


Some more context on this ...
source: talking points memo
Attorneys for Martin’s family reacted with anger on Friday, saying Zimmerman had an obligation to disclose how much money he had available when he took the witness stand last week.

“George Zimmerman raised his right hand in court and swore to tell the truth. He swore to be honest,” attorney Benjamin Crump told CNN. “He watched that whole proceeding and never once said a word to the court whether or not he had raised money on that website when he knew he had raised over $200,000. He kept claiming he was indigent so he could get a very, very low bond.”
...
Judges & lawyers smell money - eh? So do the victim's family - that's why they got a lawyer in the first place. (bolded not a lie or crime.)
http://www.cnn.com/2012/04/27/justice/florida-zimmerman-money/index.html?hpt=hp_t3 - nice of them to say he can keep!

Mark de LA says
M 2012-05-15 17:41:39 15904
& then some maybe related incidents just get covered up in the media:

Source: ... Using this case for political purposes has already come at a real cost. In Gainesville, Florida; Oak Park, Illinois; Mobile, Alabama; Toledo, Ohio; Grand Rapids, Michigan; and possibly Norfolk, Va., blacks have attacked whites in what they think is revenge for Zimmerman attacking Martin because he was black, and those are just the cases where the perpetrators would make some comment such as “This is for Trayvon.”

Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2012/05/16/what-zimmerman-martin-medical-reports-tell-us-and-media-didnt/#ixzz1v4DK10WN
...

Mark de LA says
POLL: 40% Now Say Trayvon Martin Shot in Self-Defense; 24% Say It Was Murder... 
Hopefully, the case won't be decided by a POLL!

Mark de LA says
seth 2012-05-28 07:49:56 15904
M 2012-05-28 07:07:49 15904
M 2012-05-28 07:05:46 15904

FYI, we have 3 meanings to the syllable hood

  • hood as a garment with a covering for the head
  • hood as a contraction for the word neighborhood
  • hood as in hoodlum - "young criminal, gangster"

We'll watch & see how it ultimately applies here.




Does your "it" refer to how the Trayvon event ultimately will change our use of the word "hoodie" ? 
perhaps or otherwise!


Seth says
source: Washington Post
Judge revokes Zimmerman’s bond in Trayvon Martin killing; 48 hours to surrender
Circuit Judge Kenneth Lester said Friday that George Zimmerman misled the court about how much money he had available when his bond was set for $150,000 in April. Prosecutors claim Zimmerman had $135,000 available that had been raised by a website he set up.
I had listened to that original bail hearing live.  It was really hard for me to understand then not only what happened to the money from the website, but also why the direct question did not get brought up.   I'm glad they sorted it all out finally.  The way it finally came down, was worse than having been totally honest about it form the start.


Seth says

Seth says
This is the first time i have seen such a detailed and professional looking website for one side of a court case .... gzlegalcase.com .

times change.

Mark de LA says
.. & the police chief finally resigns.  The last paragraph is rather mystifying to me. Such is the politics of the day. http://www.miamiherald.com/2012/06/20/2860209/sanford-police-chief-bill-lee.html  .
I'm glad the victim's lawyer "agrees" with the decision - aren't you?


Mark de LA says
http://www.thesmokinggun.com/buster/george-zimmerman-lie-detector-421395
source: ...

Along with questions about whether his first name was George and if it was Monday, Zimmerman was asked, “Did you confront the guy you shot?’ He answered, “No.” He was also asked, “Were you in fear for your life, when you shot the guy.” Zimmerman replied, “Yes.”

Before the CVSA test, Zimmerman--who was apparently not accompanied by legal counsel--signed a Sanford Police Department release stating that he was undergoing the examination “voluntarily, without duress, coercion, threat or promise.”

The lie detector test was requested by Chris Serino, a homicide investigator with the Sanford Police Department.

... Hmmmmm..


Mark de LA says
seth 2012-06-26 17:17:54 15904
I'm pretty sure Zimmerman was in fear for his life.  Many a man who went after a guy with his gun, and then when a fight ensued, ended up getting shot with his own gun.   What doesn't hang true is that a lone teen aged boy, with no prior record of violence, would harass and beat up a grown man and then try to grab for his gun unless he was forced to fight for his life.   Trayvon must have been in fear of his life.  That's what bothers me.
There is no evidence of that anywhere mentioned so far. There is evidence that Zimmerman was hit on the back of the head or had his head jammed against the concrete, though. Of course you ignored that he passed the lie-detector test as no evidence of deception. It is amazing that that part of the comment is so easily cast aside, isn't it? Zimmerman wasn't shot with his own gun. Were Trayvon's fingerprints on GZ's gun? Someone is
 
Select some of google trayvon martin arrested for burglary for whether he was as pure as the wind-driven snow, please.

Mark de LA says
You can just taste the race card in this whole nexus of misfortune! 
http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/07/16/us-usa-florida-shooting-idUSBRE86F0YV20120716 - they'll get him for something eventually & probably make it a hate crime.


Seth says
M 2012-07-19 11:12:20 15904
seth 2012-07-19 10:32:18 15904

source: foxnews interview
Hannity: "Is there anything that you regret? Do you regret getting out of the car to follow Trayon that night? Do you regret that you had a gun that night?"
Zimmerman: "No, sir, I feel that it was all God's plan and not for me to second-guess it or judge it."
.. to which I replied:
Mark Russell
Well, there are only 2 reasons to have a gun a) to kill someone or something (hunting etc.) b) to practice for doing a). That said then it is up to the individual under our constitution to figure out where he fits into the scheme of life l...ike protecting his family, neighborhood, the country, etc. & the consequences of his actions. God reasoning never impresses me. Mainly it is human reasoning with an infinite unknown left over. It is more the Golden Rule at all levels & in all reflections that guides me. I could never be a policeman but, I am glad we have people who are willing to police.
In the interview GZ said that TM said I am going to kill you.
See More


Well i agree that reasoning with God in the equation, is not reasoning at all.

My interest here was to record this on our history of the case and as a review of my thought some time ago which goes "What actually did happen, was what should have happened. If you actually believe in God, it is hard not to come to that conclusion."  That might sounds like it aligns with Zimmerman's "I feel that it was all God's plan and not for me to second-guess it or judge it."  The distinction goes to the heart of ethical reasoning and feelings of guilt.  I tried to teas those out here.

Mark de LA says
seth 2012-07-19 12:15:01 15904
M 2012-07-19 11:12:20 15904
seth 2012-07-19 10:32:18 15904

source: foxnews interview
Hannity: "Is there anything that you regret? Do you regret getting out of the car to follow Trayon that night? Do you regret that you had a gun that night?"
Zimmerman: "No, sir, I feel that it was all God's plan and not for me to second-guess it or judge it."
.. to which I replied:
Mark Russell
Well, there are only 2 reasons to have a gun a) to kill someone or something (hunting etc.) b) to practice for doing a). That said then it is up to the individual under our constitution to figure out where he fits into the scheme of life l...ike protecting his family, neighborhood, the country, etc. & the consequences of his actions. God reasoning never impresses me. Mainly it is human reasoning with an infinite unknown left over. It is more the Golden Rule at all levels & in all reflections that guides me. I could never be a policeman but, I am glad we have people who are willing to police.
In the interview GZ said that TM said I am going to kill you.
See More


Well i agree that reasoning with God in the equation, is not reasoning at all.

My interest here was to record this on our history of the case and as a review of my thought some time ago which goes "What actually did happen, was what should have happened. If you actually believe in God, it is hard not to come to that conclusion."  That might sounds like it aligns with Zimmerman's "I feel that it was all God's plan and not for me to second-guess it or judge it."  The distinction goes to the heart of ethical reasoning and feelings of guilt.  I tried to teas those out here.
Well, the Tao is likely to agree with GZ. Many religions including Islam seem to imply the absence of free will. God is Great, etc. This is too small a space to regurgitate the black vs white of the Tao with Christ in the middle.

Mark Russell
Well, there are only 2 reasons to have a gun a) to kill someone or something (hunting etc.) b) to practice for doing a). That said then it is up to the individual under our constitution to figure out where he fits into the scheme of life l...ike protecting his family, neighborhood, the country, etc. & the consequences of his actions. God reasoning never impresses me. Mainly it is human reasoning with an infinite unknown left over. It is more the Golden Rule at all levels & in all reflections that guides me. I could never be a policeman but, I am glad we have people who are willing to police.
In the interview GZ said that TM said I am going to kill you.
See More


Well i agree that reasoning with God in the equation, is not reasoning at all.

My interest here was to record this on our history of the case and as a review of my thought some time ago which goes "What actually did happen, was what should have happened. If you actually believe in God, it is hard not to come to that conclusion."  That might sounds like it aligns with Zimmerman's "I feel that it was all God's plan and not for me to second-guess it or judge it."  The distinction goes to the heart of ethical reasoning and feelings of guilt.  I tried to teas those out here.
Well, the Tao is likely to agree with GZ. Many religions including Islam seem to imply the absence of free will. God is Great, etc. This is too small a space to regurgitate the black vs white of the Tao with Christ in the middle.


Well i agree that reasoning with God in the equation, is not reasoning at all.

My interest here was to record this on our history of the case and as a review of my thought some time ago which goes "What actually did happen, was what should have happened. If you actually believe in God, it is hard not to come to that conclusion."  That might sounds like it aligns with Zimmerman's "I feel that it was all God's plan and not for me to second-guess it or judge it."  The distinction goes to the heart of ethical reasoning and feelings of guilt.  I tried to teas those out here.
Well, the Tao is likely to agree with GZ. Many religions including Islam seem to imply the absence of free will. God is Great, etc. This is too small a space to regurgitate the black vs white of the Tao with Christ in the middle.


Mark de LA says
Wow! I don't know how so many tao images got in there, but it's ok for me.


Mark de LA says
Nice article in The Daily on prosecutor accident?
http://www.thedaily.com/page/2012/08/10/081012-news-george-zimmerman-1-3/
This is a fairly decent news source so far. Report on Jobs' house burglary even shows police report.


Mark de LA says
seth 2012-08-23 08:10:37 15904
MR 2012-03-23 13:28:44 15904
MR 2012-03-23 12:38:30 15904
FYI, on the long hot summer thingy:



An understanding of Obama's reaction as a parent which feels better than your guffaw was expressed in this Atalantic article:  "Fear of a Black President".

Your racist insinuation is

Mark de LA says
Catch Up: http://www.foxnews.com/us/2012/12/03/newly-released-photo-shows-bloodied-george-zimmerman-from-night-trayvon-martin/
Evidence withheld?


Mark de LA says
Orlando Sentinal: ...

SANFORD — Trayvon Martin's girlfriend, the state's most important witness in the George Zimmerman murder case, was caught in a lie, it was revealed Tuesday.

It was not the first piece of misinformation tied to her, but it was the most damaging to date and left prosecutors in a very awkward position.

They had to publicly acknowledge that their star witness had lied under oath and had to answer questions about what they intend to do about it.

... the lies: she was 16 & she was in a hospital the day of Martin's funeral. The "push" is also hearsay from a lying witness.


Mark de LA says
VIA
Zimmerman's Lawyer Wants Jurors To See Photos Of Handgun, Pot Plants Found On Trayvon Martin's Phone...'Paint troubling picture'...


Mark de LA says
IMHO, the prosecutor takes after the U.S. Attorney General:
Source: ...

O'Mara said Tuesday that he felt compelled to bring this matter to the attention of the judge after a hearing earlier this month in which De la Rionda was emphatic that he'd turned over all evidence related to Martin's cellphone.

"(Kruidbos) knew information that nobody else would know about what (the state attorney's office) didn't give us," O'Mara said. "The picture of the gun in the hand, for example, had not been turned over to us. But that had been created back in late January within the state attorney's office.

"That inquiry, if in fact it continues and it certainly should, could lead to some very dire consequences for those who made presentations to the judge that were not accurate."


Read more here: http://www.miamiherald.com/2013/05/29/3422519/lawyer-zimmerman-prosecutor-withheld.html#storylink=cpy


...


Mark de LA says
Now that the trial is in progress - the prosecution has started in earnest.

Dozens of incriminating posts get deleted from TWITTER account of Trayvon Martin's friend...

RESUMES TESTIMONY; QUESTIONS ABOUT LIES...

19-year-old high school senior can't read letter she 'wrote' -- 'I don't read cursive'...

SAYS 'CRACKER' NOT A RACIAL TERM...
**


Mark de LA says


Judge Pressured by Obama Administration?

CNN: 'White Hispanic'...

Pastor Says Miami Will Be 'Ground Zero' For Riots, Looting...

... Police training 'purely coincidence'

JUAN WILLIAMS: 'Crackers,' 'teenage mammy' -- the 'sorry truth about race'...

'Nauseating Spectacle'...
I like the last minute bait & switch from murder to manslaughter by the prosecution & the attempt by all to make it a racist thingy;
taxpayer funds used by administration to support.

Seth says
after listening, more to the coverage of the case than i care to admit, i think i would find Zimmerman not guilty.  i predict that the jury will as well. 

i think the real killer here is the gun.  take the gun out of the situation, and the kid would be alive today. 

the infowars (because there is a war for your mind) ridiculous question, panders to those who's juices flow to that sort of thing ... i'm sure you are enjoying the rush.

Mark de LA says
.. & now it is revealed that tax dollars were used to hype the crowds against Zimmerman:
source: ...

A division of the U.S. Department of Justice (DOJ) was deployed to Sanford, Florida in 2012 to provide assistance for anti-George Zimmerman protests, including a rally headlined by activist Al Sharpton, according to newly released documents.

The Community Relations Service (CRS), a unit of DOJ, reported expenses related to its deployment in Sanford to help manage protests between March and April 2012, according to documents obtained by the watchdog group Judicial Watch.

...
CIVIL RIGHTS MY ASS!IMPEACH!

Mark de LA says
seth 2013-07-12 08:22:06 15904
after listening, more to the coverage of the case than i care to admit, i think i would find Zimmerman not guilty.  i predict that the jury will as well. 

i think the real killer here is the gun.  take the gun out of the situation, and the kid would be alive today. 

the infowars (because there is a war for your mind) ridiculous question, panders to those who's juices flow to that sort of thing ... i'm sure you are enjoying the rush.
You had better not walk into a gun store or a firing range because those guns are gonna rile themselves into a frenzy & shoot you all by themselves!


Mark de LA says
Yeah I saw the movie some time ago. That scene was powerful.  I would say it is irrelevant to the current trial. Let actors do your summations nowadays? It's not about the law or the current facts, but how much either side can get the emotions to a fever pitch to convict or acquit?  Did the prosecutor use the cut or memorize it & deliver it himself? I didn't watch the trial.


Seth says
I found it interesting that in the final summation the prosecution used this powerful thought experiment from the movie "A Time to Kill".  That would not have been my choice, in the end, in the court room, the case was not presented to be "about race" ... and it was not about race.  Zimmerman profiled Travon as a criminal, not as a black man. 

but the movie was about race .. watch the cut ... let me know if you could without tearing ...



Mark de LA says
seth 2013-07-12 13:37:48 15904
MR 2013-07-12 12:41:34 15904
seth 2013-07-12 12:24:57 15904
MR 2013-07-12 12:15:31 15904
Yeah I saw the movie some time ago. That scene was powerful.  I would say it is irrelevant to the current trial. Let actors do your summations nowadays? It's not about the law or the current facts, but how much either side can get the emotions to a fever pitch to convict or acquit?  Did the prosecutor use the cut or memorize it & deliver it himself? I didn't watch the trial.

i thought is was a bit confusing how he used the same experiment in summation ... was he saying it was about race ... or that it was not about race?  Denise thought it was being used facetiously ... i tend to agree.  Maybe in time someone will post that cut along with this one.   Then you can decide.  
Maybe it wasn't for the all women jury, but the people in the street who are expected to riot if GZ is not convicted of something.  That cut was way too emotional & powerful & out of context for the trial today to be used as a joke!

I'm thinking of prosecutorial/judicial misconduct. Trial & defense was about murder & at last minute they call for lesser included manslaughter conviction (30 years at stake) ?  They couldn't prove murder 2?

well i seriously doubt there will be any appreciable riot in the streets after the verdict ... the expectation of that tells me more about the people doing the expecting than it does about the situation that obtains today. 

the trial had to happen just because otherwise there would not have been a view into the facts of what happened that day ... now that we have those, i think most people will accept the verdict of the joury.  those of you who are listening for this to be about race are in fact yourselves pandering to racial juices ... see 10838.
False finger-pointing!  There has already been a bunch of speculation & even the cops & so forth are making preparations. http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2013/07/12/zimmerman-verdict-police-prep/2511995/
Look at the OJ trial & Rodney King ....
somebody must have had their head somewhere else to ignore the news.

Seth says
MR 2013-07-12 12:15:31 15904
Yeah I saw the movie some time ago. That scene was powerful.  I would say it is irrelevant to the current trial. Let actors do your summations nowadays? It's not about the law or the current facts, but how much either side can get the emotions to a fever pitch to convict or acquit?  Did the prosecutor use the cut or memorize it & deliver it himself? I didn't watch the trial.

i thought is was a bit confusing how he used the same experiment in summation ... was he saying it was about race ... or that it was not about race?  Denise thought it was being used facetiously ... i tend to agree.  Maybe in time someone will post that cut along with this one.   Then you can decide.  

Mark de LA says
seth 2013-07-12 12:24:57 15904
MR 2013-07-12 12:15:31 15904
Yeah I saw the movie some time ago. That scene was powerful.  I would say it is irrelevant to the current trial. Let actors do your summations nowadays? It's not about the law or the current facts, but how much either side can get the emotions to a fever pitch to convict or acquit?  Did the prosecutor use the cut or memorize it & deliver it himself? I didn't watch the trial.

i thought is was a bit confusing how he used the same experiment in summation ... was he saying it was about race ... or that it was not about race?  Denise thought it was being used facetiously ... i tend to agree.  Maybe in time someone will post that cut along with this one.   Then you can decide.  
Maybe it wasn't for the all women jury, but the people in the street who are expected to riot if GZ is not convicted of something.  That cut was way too emotional & powerful & out of context for the trial today to be used as a joke!

I'm thinking of prosecutorial/judicial misconduct. Trial & defense was about murder & at last minute they call for lesser included manslaughter conviction (30 years at stake) ?  They couldn't prove murder 2?

Seth says
MR 2013-07-12 12:41:34 15904
seth 2013-07-12 12:24:57 15904
MR 2013-07-12 12:15:31 15904
Yeah I saw the movie some time ago. That scene was powerful.  I would say it is irrelevant to the current trial. Let actors do your summations nowadays? It's not about the law or the current facts, but how much either side can get the emotions to a fever pitch to convict or acquit?  Did the prosecutor use the cut or memorize it & deliver it himself? I didn't watch the trial.

i thought is was a bit confusing how he used the same experiment in summation ... was he saying it was about race ... or that it was not about race?  Denise thought it was being used facetiously ... i tend to agree.  Maybe in time someone will post that cut along with this one.   Then you can decide.  
Maybe it wasn't for the all women jury, but the people in the street who are expected to riot if GZ is not convicted of something.  That cut was way too emotional & powerful & out of context for the trial today to be used as a joke!

I'm thinking of prosecutorial/judicial misconduct. Trial & defense was about murder & at last minute they call for lesser included manslaughter conviction (30 years at stake) ?  They couldn't prove murder 2?

well i seriously doubt there will be any appreciable riot in the streets after the verdict ... the expectation of that tells me more about the people doing the expecting than it does about the situation that obtains today. 

the trial had to happen just because otherwise there would not have been a view into the facts of what happened that day ... now that we have those, i think most people will accept the verdict of the joury.  those of you who are listening for this to be about race are in fact yourselves pandering to racial juices ... see 10838.

Seth says
yeah yeah there are always some people who, like you, will focus on shit ... but strangely enough we are dealing here with factual predictions ... and what actually does happen will tell us who has their head up their ass.  Mark my predictions:  "Zimmerman will be acquitted, and there will be no substantive violent riots". --- Bozo Faust July 12, 2013 4pm PST.

Mark de LA says
seth 2013-07-12 16:22:22 15904
MR 2013-07-12 16:13:23 15904
seth 2013-07-12 15:58:07 15904
yeah yeah there are always some people who, like you, will focus on shit ... but strangely enough we are dealing here with factual predictions ... and what actually does happen will tell us who has their head up their ass.  Mark my predictions:  "Zimmerman will be acquitted, and there will be no substantive violent riots". --- Bozo Faust July 12, 2013 4pm PST.
Why did the police etc. make preparations? Do you have your head up your ass?

abundance of caution.
... while hiding your head in the usual orifice . I predict the opposite.


Seth says
MR 2013-07-12 16:13:23 15904
seth 2013-07-12 15:58:07 15904
yeah yeah there are always some people who, like you, will focus on shit ... but strangely enough we are dealing here with factual predictions ... and what actually does happen will tell us who has their head up their ass.  Mark my predictions:  "Zimmerman will be acquitted, and there will be no substantive violent riots". --- Bozo Faust July 12, 2013 4pm PST.
Why did the police etc. make preparations? Do you have your head up your ass?

abundance of caution.

Seth says
MR 2013-07-12 16:26:45 15904
seth 2013-07-12 16:22:22 15904
MR 2013-07-12 16:13:23 15904
seth 2013-07-12 15:58:07 15904
yeah yeah there are always some people who, like you, will focus on shit ... but strangely enough we are dealing here with factual predictions ... and what actually does happen will tell us who has their head up their ass.  Mark my predictions:  "Zimmerman will be acquitted, and there will be no substantive violent riots". --- Bozo Faust July 12, 2013 4pm PST.
Why did the police etc. make preparations? Do you have your head up your ass?

abundance of caution.
... while hiding your head in the usual orifice . I predict the opposite.


Kewl ...... we will see the power of the law of attracthin here ... or not, perhaps we will just see who has the more accutate and objective perceptions.   me, i fovor the latter .... err, thing is we may end you thinking you predicted what happened and simultaneously me thinking that i predicted what happened also.  in other words, if facts end up being somwhat subjective, then you will claim any demonstrations whatsoever will prove your prediction ... alternative i will tend to discount minor demonstrations.  of course, maybe zimmerman may end up being found guilty ... in which case, i predict no semi white people will demonstrate .

Mark de LA says
seth 2013-07-12 16:33:23 15904
MR 2013-07-12 16:26:45 15904
seth 2013-07-12 16:22:22 15904
MR 2013-07-12 16:13:23 15904
seth 2013-07-12 15:58:07 15904
yeah yeah there are always some people who, like you, will focus on shit ... but strangely enough we are dealing here with factual predictions ... and what actually does happen will tell us who has their head up their ass.  Mark my predictions:  "Zimmerman will be acquitted, and there will be no substantive violent riots". --- Bozo Faust July 12, 2013 4pm PST.
Why did the police etc. make preparations? Do you have your head up your ass?

abundance of caution.
... while hiding your head in the usual orifice . I predict the opposite.


Kewl ...... we will see the power of the law of attracthin here ... or not, perhaps we will just see who has the more accutate and objective perceptions.   me, i fovor the latter .... err, thing is we may end you thinking you predicted what happened and simultaneously me thinking that i predicted what happened also.  in other words, if facts end up being somwhat subjective, then you will claim any demonstrations whatsoever will prove your prediction ... alternative i will tend to discount minor demonstrations.  of course, maybe zimmerman may end up being found guilty ... in which case, i predict no semi white people will demonstrate .
Basically we will find out none of the above. I just mismatched your prediction.
One semi-serious question, though exists in a cursory examination of news accounts of the trial & that is: why did Travon Martin get in a a fight with George Zimmerman? Was that ever explained?


Seth says
Rachel Jeantel’s testimony starts about 1hr:04minutes into this video.   It is quite colorful and hard to understand.   It's clear to me, based upon Jeantel's recount of their cell phone conversation that Zimmerman was following Travon ... that Jentel suggested that he was a rapist ....  and that Travon wanted to "loose" him ... then Travon said "oh shit, niggar is right behind me" ... then there was a thump, and then some sounds of a scuffle (my characterization),  and then Travon's cell phone hit the ground and phone went dead.   Maybe somebody has provided a better transript/translation that would be clearer to parse.

I think one could reasonably suspect that Travon got so irritated by being watched that he attacked Zimmerman and got the drop on him.  Or even that Jeantel is making up parts of their conversation. 

Mark de LA says
Yeah, I watched a little of hers in the beginning, but didn't find her that credible or her body language congruent. What were their relative sizes height/weight? if known.  If Trayvon was bigger, why didn't he just run? GZ a rapist - not the first thing I would think of in that situation, robbery or something maybe.  Anyway, it is in the hands of a jury .
 

Seth says
source: Mark asks
One semi-serious question, though exists in a cursory examination of news accounts of the trial & that is: why did Travon Martin get in a a fight with George Zimmerman? Was that ever explained?

Well the only testimony we have as to what Travon was thinking is from his girl friend who was on the phone with him just before the encounter. According to my memory,  they were talking about Zimmerman following,  whether he was a pervert, and whether Travon should run or not.  You probably could find a youtube of her testimony.  Of course the prosecution would like us to believe that Travon was fighting for his life because he was being threatened by the gun ... the defense would like us to believe he attacked Zimmerman because he was following and gawking.  As far as i know there is no incontrovertible evidence one way or the other.   

You posted articles about Rachel Jeantel’s  testimony above, but they were all about trying to discredit her based on unrelated matters.  To get the whole story seek out the articles about when she testified for the prosecution.

Mark de LA says
Meanwhile dig the M$M distortion & ponder:
source: ... According to the Chicago Sun-Times, 82 people have been shot in Chicago in the past week.
...
I tried googling this phrase without the quotes
 blacks killed in chicago last week & got a whole lot of zimmerman instead.

go figure...
It would truly be fascinating to chronicle how many were killed in the 17 months since this story entered the news; especially how many black on black teenagers were killed.


Mark de LA says
... & then there is this point of view:
Aljazerra: ... (title:
Opinion

In the trial of Trayvon, the US is guilty



The verdict in the Trayvon Martin case exemplifies growing racism in the United States.

When I was a child I watched policemen beat a man nearly to death, and I watched my country acquit them. I was shocked that police would attack a man instead of defending him. I was shocked that someone would record the attack on video and that this video would mean nothing. I was shocked that people could watch things and not really see them. I was shocked because I was a child. I was shocked because I am white.

Twenty-one years after the Rodney King verdict, Americans have proven again that in a court of law, perception matters more than proof. Perception is rooted in power, a power bestowed upon birth, reified through experience, and verified through discrimination masked as fairness and fact.

Trayvon Martin is dead and the man who killed him walks free. Americans are afraid there will be riots, like there were after the King verdict in 1992. But we should not fear riots. We should fear a society that puts people on trial the day they are born. And after they die.

...


Mark de LA says
seth 2013-07-14 08:40:35 15904
seth 2013-07-12 15:58:07 [item 15904]
yeah yeah there are always some people who, like you, will focus on shit ... but strangely enough we are dealing here with factual predictions ... and what actually does happen will tell us who has their head up their ass.  Mark my predictions:  "Zimmerman will be acquitted, and there will be no substantive violent riots". --- Bozo Faust July 12, 2013 4pm PST.
Bozo's prediction vindicated:  South Florida peaceful but passionate following Zimmerman trial verdict [of not guilty]. 
... the weekend is not over yet! Nice prediction though. Lots of post mortems to go over in the media until we snooze .

Seth says
today, our president, provided pitch perfect leadership on the problem ...



Seth says
media bias of some kind?

Seth says

'Who will Obama identify with on this one?'

Seth says
Might be interesting, but probably not:http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2400288/Paula-Deen-SHOOTS-Trayvon-Martin-new-SVU-episode.html
I'll bet they leave out the rash of shootings of black on whites like the one above & this one:

'SHORTY' LEFT FOR DEAD...
WWII vet, 88, beaten to death by black teens...
Suspect photos released...
...

Outrage anyone?




Seth says
ME 2013-11-18 13:28:21 15904
seth 2013-11-18 12:56:04 15904
ME 2013-11-18 12:43:54 15904

it just reinforces my opinion that the man is a bad actor.  it needed to be included here to keep this item as a good record of the context.
I guess Tayvon AND George were BOTH bad actors.

source: CNN
George Zimmerman was arrested after he allegedly pointed a shotgun at his girlfriend, the Seminole County Sheriff's Office said.
... perhaps this man really should not be allowed to have a gun, eh?

Seth says
seth 2013-11-18 12:56:04 15904
ME 2013-11-18 12:43:54 15904

it just reinforces my opinion that the man is a bad actor.  it needed to be included here to keep this item as a good record of the context.
I guess Tayvon AND George were BOTH bad actors.


Seth says
ME 2013-11-18 15:49:53 15904
seth 2013-11-18 14:55:39 15904
source: TMZ
2:14 PM PT  According to the Seminole County Sheriff, the woman was not pregnant ...  but we're told she told the 911 dispatcher she was.  The Sheriff says the woman claims Zimmerman pointed a DOUBLE BARREL SHOTGUN at her, pushed her out of the house.  He then allegedly barricaded the front door with furniture.  
... i guess if she had punched him he could have shot her in the face and claimed self defense
Or perhaps it is just another ugly domestic fight in which lies get spread around for the police to sort out.  I don't give much of a shit about this anymore .  Keep cranking up the race card though & maybe someone will shoot da' Zim.


well actually i don't think this last one has anything whatsoever to do with race ... and, for that matter the first one was, imho, not about race either .... for me it has always been about guns.

Seth says
seth 2013-11-18 14:55:39 15904
source: TMZ
2:14 PM PT  According to the Seminole County Sheriff, the woman was not pregnant ...  but we're told she told the 911 dispatcher she was.  The Sheriff says the woman claims Zimmerman pointed a DOUBLE BARREL SHOTGUN at her, pushed her out of the house.  He then allegedly barricaded the front door with furniture.  
... i guess if she had punched him he could have shot her in the face and claimed self defense
Or perhaps it is just another ugly domestic fight in which lies get spread around for the police to sort out.  I don't give much of a shit about this anymore .  Keep cranking up the race card though & maybe someone will shoot da' Zim.


Seth says
... Georege Zimmerman shot

what goes around comes around ... or in other words, live by the sword, die by the sword.

Eiam says
seth 2015-05-11 12:58:26 15904
... Georege Zimmerman shot

what goes around comes around ... or in other words, live by the sword, die by the sword.
Likewise for whoever shot him, eh?

Seth says
Mark 2016-02-05 07:59:44 [item 15904#44673]
I think indentation shows the nesting cleaner than forking. laughing No right wrong game (rwg) here, eh? Just people expressing their ego & opinions. smug
i think there is a point for each. 

Thing is, when does a person’s “reply”  fork, diverge, differentiate … or when does it continue along the same path.  Both of those will happen.   How does it feel to the people conversing when they are right there making the continuations of thought or the divergances of thought   …. and how does it look later to people trying to read it vicariously.

Seth says
Mark 2016-02-05 07:59:44 [item 15904#44673]
I think indentation shows the nesting cleaner than forking. laughing No right wrong game (rwg) here, eh? Just people expressing their ego & opinions. smug
Mark 2016-02-05 08:14:33 [item 15904#44675]
Did a rose (rose) ever grow out of this (*) manure pile? 
  • George not doing well
  • Sharpton – have not heard from in a long time
  • Obama – opens flood gates so blacks & whites moving towards minority status (cloward-piven) – Glenn Beck moved from Fox & is going broke
  • race-card still around ? – Ben Carson was running for president from right-side of politics. 
  • … Me(I) focusing outside politics 
me2 … but i’m still watching the political specticle … especially the Trump effect.  i am just not like feeling that i am at all involved … more like watching a movie … just entertainment for me … and maybe a bit of a consciousness of another world.

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