At Cause

About: Werner Erhard Ideas and Applications on Facebook

source: ... "To take a stand that you are cause in the matter contrasts with it being your fault, or that you failed, or that you are to blame, or even that you did it.

That you are the cause of everything in your life is a place to stand from which to view and deal with life " a place that exists solely as a matter of your choice. The stand that one is cause in the matter is a declaration, not an assertion of fact. It simply says, “you can count on me (and I can count on you) to look and deal with life from the perspective of my being cause in the matter.”

When you have taken the stand (declared) that you are cause in the matter of your life it means that you give up the right to assign cause to the circumstances, or to others. That is, you give up the right to be a victim. You also give up the right to assign cause to the waxing and waning of your state of mind " all of which, while undoubtedly soothing, leave you helpless (at the effect of).

At the same time, taking this stand does not prevent you from holding others responsible"
... This Werner Erhard quote on facebook might be an indicator of how to get out of the right-wrong game or any other game like the One-upmanship game . Maybe, if followed, could restore some integrity & balance to politics, or .…
 
A fascinating comment on political context 3 years ago.
 
A black film poster, reading in small print at the top "FRANCIS FORD COPPOLA PRESENTS" with "KOYAANISQATSI" in large red text, subtitled below with "LIFE OUT OF BALANCE"  The white text in the middle reads "October 4, 1982. More than 5,000 people filled out the sold out Radio City Music Hall to experience a remarkable film event.  That event was the world premiere of KOYAANISQATSI.  Now everyone can share the power of that experience."  Below that text, reads "DIRECTED BY Godfrey Reggio, MUSIC BY Philip Glass, CINEMATOGRAPHY BY Ron Fricke".  Various logos are at the bottom of the poster.(*)

Tags

  1. declaration
  2. werner erhard
  3. item 17170

Comments


Mark de LA says
seth 2014-08-01 09:18:46 17588
an interesting mix of ideas indeed .

Incidentally, after a bit of study of the way it went down, i don't think d'A saying "upping" to you was an accusation of gaming ... but rather of a standing on shoulders which is a win/win game unlike rwg.  the way katya picked up on that i thought was beautiful.  to me a spectacularly communicative dialouge all around ... sorry that apparently your experienced it differently. 
You should leave these ideas on facebook where the conversation should remain.  This item is about the way out of the RWG & other such ideas like I am better than you things. The Impropaganda idea also helps. I choose to be at cause in not extending the RWG whenever I can.


Mark de LA says
Elsewise I am complete that you are incomplete about it all. v

Mark de LA says
seth 2014-08-01 11:07:53 17588
Why do you continue to assume that i do not understand Erhard's declaration?  Was it something i said?  Fact is that i think it is great ... "I am the cause of the matters of my life." -- Seth Russell 2014.  It is mostly the stuff he says after that ... hopefully i don't need to repeat that ... that stuff is incomplete as it applies to me. 
Because your incompleteness belies your understanding. Doubt also is a self protector & gives that wiggly thingy roomy for not having to keep one's word or declare one's stand. That's why in politics some factions prefer not to stand on principles but rather prefer to pander to identity groups.


Mark de LA says
seth 2014-08-02 09:50:06 17588
source: mark
I think Werner said something more profound which is still missing from your ontology
... oh!  What?
I said that it's missing from your ontology. I have tried many times to unconceal it, but your me,I just won't let you open the door to it. Not going to waste my time any more especially into a mismatching listening which is basically some people do this & that sometimes and sometimes not (BTW, off topic anyway) .
Enjoy your profundity .


Mark de LA says
seth 2014-08-01 09:58:26 17588
M 2014-08-01 09:38:57 17588
seth 2014-08-01 09:32:48 17588
M 2014-08-01 09:23:37 17588
seth 2014-08-01 09:18:46 17588
an interesting mix of ideas indeed .

Incidentally, after a bit of study of the way it went down, i don't think d'A saying "upping" to you was an accusation of gaming ... but rather of a standing on shoulders which is a win/win game unlike rwg.  the way katya picked up on that i thought was beautiful.  to me a spectacularly communicative dialouge all around ... sorry that apparently your experienced it differently. 

You should leave these ideas on facebook where the conversation should remain.  This item is about the way out of the RWG & other such ideas like I am better than you things. The Impropaganda idea also helps. I choose to be at cause in not extending the RWG whenever I can.


yeah this goes pretty deep ... not easily summed up in a short paragraph.  there are some contradictions that appear in Erhards stance to me.  Not looking to blame others is certainly King ... that totally works for me.   Not acknowledging others effect even upon myslef ... well not so very.   For me that kind of like assuming that i am the center of The World ... which i know for a fact that i am not.  Perhaps Impropaganda does have a way out of that bind ... i really do not know.
Yeah, maybe master the term declaration & the surroundings of that sentence where it appeared. Such has a foundation, a principle if you please, which has at its core the idea that I am my word - integrity.


yeah i do think i have mastered the declaration part of that.  

thing is i will not declare at once that i am the only cause in my life and then turn around and deny your affect on me.   that is not really fair to you.   so the declaration and the will to carry it works to get me past the blame game ... fine ... but then with the follow up fine print, plunks me right into an island of solipsistic attitudes twards others and the very lack of communication that we have going ourselves.  so my declaration needs to harmonize not only with my own thrust of deed, but also with the nature of the social environment in which i swim.  I am not an island in my own carrerr in The World or even my progress in Spiritual Domains ... rather I am a being happening as part of a higher being's happenings including all others.  I think Erhard's declaration might well be a solution for someone obsessively centered in themselves ... me i'm not so very ... your perceptions notwithstanding.

Yeah! I guess I can't explain Werner Erhard to you (my bad ) .... too much centered in a principle like I am my word, integrity, declaration, making promises etc. . living up to one's word .. shit I have already done here at fbi; stuff I spent a lot time examining several years ago.  Then too holding on to that me,I thingy is more solipsism than implied in Werner's words & however you took them over there.


Seth says
Well I think sometimes we are a cause and other times we let a cause flow through us.  Sometimes we act and sometimes we react.  Sometimes we are sensitive to what is happening and other times we create what happens.  Sometimes we lead and sometimes we follow.

Mark de LA says
seth 2014-08-02 06:21:27 17588
Well I think sometimes we are a cause and other times we let a cause flow through us.  Sometimes we act and sometimes we react.  Sometimes we are sensitive to what is happening and other times we create what happens.  Sometimes we lead and sometimes we follow.
I think Werner said something more profound which is still missing from your ontology; the birdies notwithstanding.


Seth says
M 2014-08-02 13:53:10 17588
seth 2014-08-02 09:50:06 17588
source: mark
I think Werner said something more profound which is still missing from your ontology
... oh!  What?
I said that it's missing from your ontology. I have tried many times to unconceal it, but your me,I just won't let you open the door to it. Not going to waste my time any more especially into a mismatching listening which is basically some people do this & that sometimes and sometimes not (BTW, off topic anyway) .
Enjoy your profundity .


so you make accusations that something is missing, but you do not tell me what.   i call that negativity with no content.  rather useless to me. 

that is all you are recently mark ... just an attitude of disrespect for me and superiority with no content attached.  it is getting less and less usful to me to attempt to communicate with you any more.  maybe see you later when you are feeling better about youself and the world.  sorry, i can't take much more of this.

Mark de LA says
seth 2014-08-01 13:52:13 17588
M 2014-08-01 13:33:09 17588
seth 2014-08-01 13:20:20 17588
M 2014-08-01 11:19:03 17588
seth 2014-08-01 11:07:53 17588
Why do you continue to assume that i do not understand Erhard's declaration?  Was it something i said?  Fact is that i think it is great ... "I am the cause of the matters of my life." -- Seth Russell 2014.  It is mostly the stuff he says after that ... hopefully i don't need to repeat that ... that stuff is incomplete as it applies to me. 
Because your incompleteness belies your understanding. Doubt also is a self protector & gives that wiggly thingy roomy for not having to keep one's word or declare one's stand. That's why in politics some factions prefer not to stand on principles but rather prefer to pander to identity groups.


I have no doubt or incompleteness in my declaration that "I am the cause of the matters in my life".   While i am just as certain that the things i do cause effects in you, and that the things you do cause effects in me.   If you think that expresses doubt or logical contradiction then you need to delve deeper perhaps abandoning traditional patterns of thought.
He & I are not talking about effects ... maybe you need to read more carefully.

The is no way to talk about "cause" without also talking about "effect" ... no more than we could talk about a force with no thingey forced.  Instead of the way you parsed my sentence above, try parsing it this way: "i am just as certain that the things i do cause effects in you, and that the things you do cause effects in me".  I just made explicit in my stance that aspect of cause that apparently you think Erhard is not dealing with. 
Yep, you seem to be arguing about something else, like being a victim of other people causing things in you.  This is not about that.  A BIG CLUE is the difference between people running around being victims & people rising to being at cause in matters of their life. Being at cause in one's life does not mean that things won't be in your way & people won't oppose what you are doing. What it does mean is that you have a context to handle it in such a way that you can summon greater states of being from which you can solve your problems & hindrances.  You are certainly welcome to becoming a state-machine with others holding the strings. I can be at peace with that if such is your desire. Me, i ....


Mark de LA says
seth 2014-08-02 09:06:59 17588
M 2014-08-02 07:24:49 17588
seth 2014-08-02 06:21:27 17588
Well I think sometimes we are a cause and other times we let a cause flow through us.  Sometimes we act and sometimes we react.  Sometimes we are sensitive to what is happening and other times we create what happens.  Sometimes we lead and sometimes we follow.
I think Werner said something more profound which is still missing from your ontology; the birdies notwithstanding.


Anyway, Mark, that paragraph is true for me ... is it not also true for you?  Or are you always the cause in everything you say and do?  (similar questions could be asked for each sentence in my paragraph)
While it may be true - so what? ... seems a bit like the rwg  -

Seth says
source: mark
I think Werner said something more profound which is still missing from your ontology
... oh!  What?

Mark de LA says
Image may contain: 1 person, text

Mark de LA says

 

Mark de LA says
You brushed aside Werner’s  “I am at cause” stand for your wishy-washy “maybe/maybe-NOT” munge-factor so as not to have to face it. null In Werner linguistics a stand is a context in which you hold your own life. One can invent one’s own context & become.  One can brush aside the paradoxes & philosophy & piles of words of whether something is true for me or you or someone else & go for integrity with your own context.

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