Politics IS a Religion

About: title not given

Wikipedia: ... The Cloward"Piven strategy is a political strategy outlined in 1966 by American sociologists and political activists Richard Cloward and Frances Fox Piven that called for overloading the U.S. public welfare system in order to precipitate a crisis that would lead to a replacement of the welfare system with a national system of "a guaranteed annual income and thus an end to poverty". Cloward and Piven were a married couple who were both professors at the Columbia University School of Social Work. The strategy was formulated in a May 1966 article in the liberal[1] magazine The Nation titled "The Weight of the Poor: A Strategy to End Poverty".[2]
... (mo here)
Is there an Antidote?
U.S. Immigrant Population Hits All-Time High: 41.3 Million People
Why not encourage other countries to reform & adopt some principles in freedom ?

Tags

  1. guaranteed annual wage
  2. abundance
  3. cloward
  4. piven
  5. cloward-piven

Comments


Mark de LA says
seth 2014-09-25 07:38:01 17791

Given the abundant resources around us, i have frequently thought that a minimal level of subsistance should be provided to all.   I'm just not so very sure that i want the federal government to be involved in distributing it.  They do stuff like that so very poorly.
It is sorta like the zero-tolerance thingy in the school system for guns or drugs where a kid can be suspended for drawing a picture of a gun or sharing an aspirin with a friend for pain. There is no intelligence in laws & rules that do not include freedom from the lowest common denominator.


Seth says
Einai 2014-09-25 08:47:16 17791
seth 2014-09-25 07:54:17 17791
i think it is more like freedom from the lowest common threat.
Some think that way, but is not more like that. The religion of politics makes it so that strategies like Cloward-Piven are ignored until the soporific of Bread & Circuses is complete enough at the religion of the Federal Government is all there is. THe Federal Government doesn't want competition from other religions unless it serves its own power like overwhelming local services. The Pope did O a favor.  The War on Poverty was a failure. The lowest common denominator seems to be there no matter what has been done - 15 trillion$,$$$,$$$,$$$,$$$ later.


yeah i tend to agree ... which is why i don't want the government to do the distribution.  so no politicians involved.  but then i'm not quite so very sure how to make it work.  maybe a entirely differnet distribution network growing with entirely different assumptions to start with ... something more like the old Indian attitudes twards possessions ... or family ... or charity ... or brotherhood ... not quite sure how all of those would mesh up in a distribution network where nobody had to worry about the basics of human existence.

Mark de LA says
Going for the principle of a dynamic equilibrium of the economic domain & threefoldness has always seemed the best direction for me. Your efforts are laudable for your area in Wa. Movements in the direction of getting the federal government out of the economy is such a principle.  Some of the stuff Michael Strong & family are into are good things.
One personal good step is to take your own psychology & memes about money & rearrange the fantasies & fallacies about money so that abundance is attracted. One can't hate banks & money & attract it or have any extra to share with others inside that box & labyrinth .
(imho - which is neither - of course)


Mark de LA says
seth 2014-09-25 09:30:29 17791
yeah prolly best to just ignore the banks (etc) ... but why even want to attract the money ourselves? .... just need to attract what it is used to buy. 


me thinks by networking there is a way to make the resources themselves fungible.  i think that fungibility is the only part of money we really need.
It used to be called barter. Barter is unlikely to scale up & be flexible without some way of counting.


Mark de LA says
Bitcoin contracts maybe. google bitcoin contracts - there are a lot of schemes. The complexity commands that some principles become established otherwise the same old money thingies evolve.

Mark de LA says
seth 2014-09-26 11:50:32 17791

mark, talking about what i did not say is your walled garden passing mine like a lonely train in the night ... no connection possible on that track. 


Nope what did you mean (don't just repeat the shit) by:
here is one:  our society's obsession with private property. 

the benefit would be a less wasteful way of distributing resources.
Anyway what would YOU be willing to give up?


Mark de LA says
BTW people silos is very efficient for goods distribution & human contact.

Mark de LA says
Einai 2014-09-26 13:55:41 17791
Are you willing to give up YOUR OBSESSION with private property? Actually to a small degree we did some of that at PJ2.  You have mostly missed the entire point of the question.

Basically we could go back evolutionary-wise and live like ants & bees & wildebeests. Maybe share your woman with the biggest dude than can topple you, eh? 

Mark de LA says
seth 2014-09-26 14:05:06 17791
Einai 2014-09-26 13:55:41 17791
Are you willing to give up YOUR OBSESSION with private property? Actually to a small degree we did some of that at PJ2.  You have mostly missed the entire point of the question.


yes i am.  that is a direct answer to your question.

That does not mean that i want everybody to join communist communes run by the government.  If people shared their food, property, resources and information more, then humanity would grow in the right direction ... imho, of course.  I am quite prepared to give up all of that hoarding and fear of depletion and make the door into my house more open to the human community around me.  We have a word for it up here in the North West ... it's called "community".  But, ok, it might have a strange communistic ring to some in California.
Are you willing to let other people drive your electric car?  I did that with my ford pickup truck @ PJ2 & they overloaded it with the dirt & wrecked the clutch & other parts but did not help fix it. I gave some money to help build a local dry goods store with beans & dried fruit & somehow they all decided it was free.  Human nature is not easy to give up. 
The basic problem now is government interference in the free market & the insertion of favoritism regulations for votes & money.   I would give that all up for truly independent elections. & a hybrid of bottom up & top down management of capital resources.


Mark de LA says
Einai 2014-09-26 14:16:22 17791
BTW people silos is very efficient for goods distribution & human contact.
Some wonderful pictures of the silos across the country etc. here & a lot more information.



Mark de LA says
Einai 2014-09-27 10:44:00 17791
Einai 2014-09-26 14:16:22 17791
BTW people silos is very efficient for goods distribution & human contact.
Some wonderful pictures of the silos across the country etc. here & a lot more information.


Maybe this link goes to Seattle - testing.

Seth says
Einai 2014-09-27 10:57:42 17791
Einai 2014-09-27 10:44:00 17791
Einai 2014-09-26 14:16:22 17791
BTW people silos is very efficient for goods distribution & human contact.
Some wonderful pictures of the silos across the country etc. here & a lot more information.


Maybe this link goes to Seattle - testing.

well yeah , the way we structure our environment matters.  some things can happen when the walls go up, that could not happen without them.   things happen in the subburbs that couldn't happen down town.  yet i keep seeing things happening in Seattle than i just can not see happening here in Renton.  but then designed communities give me the spooks ... so i don't know.  this is where i am so very glad that humanity is big enough that everything can be tried at the same time ... and everybody is not forced to do it the same way.

Mark de LA says
seth 2014-09-28 08:44:49 17791
Einai 2014-09-27 10:57:42 17791
Einai 2014-09-27 10:44:00 17791
Einai 2014-09-26 14:16:22 17791
BTW people silos is very efficient for goods distribution & human contact.
Some wonderful pictures of the silos across the country etc. here & a lot more information.


Maybe this link goes to Seattle - testing.

well yeah , the way we structure our environment matters.  some things can happen when the walls go up, that could not happen without them.   things happen in the subburbs that couldn't happen down town.  yet i keep seeing things happening in Seattle than i just can not see happening here in Renton.  but then designed communities give me the spooks ... so i don't know.  this is where i am so very glad that humanity is big enough that everything can be tried at the same time ... and everybody is not forced to do it the same way.
Yep, most of these cities were not "designed communities" .

See Also

  1. Thought Unchanging Earth - Unchanging Politics with 9 viewings related by tag "cloward-piven".
  2. Thought about: resource-based economy - occupyconcepts with 0 viewings related by tag "abundance".
  3. Thought about: palmer amaranth | eat the weeds and other things, too with 0 viewings related by tag "abundance".
  4. Thought Living in OIL Scarcity or Abundance ? with 0 viewings related by tag "abundance".
  5. Thought Ebola & Cloward-Piven with 0 viewings related by tag "cloward".
  6. Thought What Kind of Being Does it Take to RIOT? with 0 viewings related by tag "cloward-piven".