long assed dialogue with myself ...

(#A) every thought has a qualia ... in that it has a distinct feel to it as it is thunk.  usually, me thinks, how it feels is related to how its content is expected to affect our selves.  example, thinking "he is going to shoot me", is going to have a distinct fear attached, were it have to be thought and also ring true.

... not quite sure where this is going ... thinking out loud here.  so far this should not be controversial at all ... let's see if we can get into the interesting part ...

so let's say that we think a thought about a thought ... a meta thought as it were.  for example i think a new thought, something that i never thought before ... let's call that thought T.  Now T felt a certain way when i thunk it, call that Tq. 

so then we proceed to think a subsequent thought call it  S(T), ... which could be about another new thought or or just about our thinking T, or about how thinking T felt, S(Tq).

hold on ... this gets a bit complex ... need to be clear on the semantics ... but i think there might be enough here to tease out a moment that happened this morning.  the point being in the area of discouraging certain kinds of S(Tq) ... or of seeing them for what they are ... or of being able to strike a certain attitude towards them ... or of attracting ones that are useful and contribute to good swimming and discouraging ones that do not.   i actually think i am doing part of that quite naturally and it is working somewhat to a certain extent.  this item here is an attempt to become more aware of what i am doing in this regard. 

... this is very personal to me and almost certainly does not apply to anybody else.  so read it at your own peril, and try not to project your own shit or dogma upon it.

Inevitably what i think i am getting at is the ability to feel good about something (a deed, a thought, a feeling) and about the qulalia of that thing too ... point being that usually i have left that just up to whatever ... but it occurs to me that i have quite a bit of control of how i feel about those meta awarenesses ... perhaps even more than the original occurrences.  So in that sense i can become my own guide.  There are some phiosophical implications there too.  LOL calls it a higher self ... RS calls it a guardian angel ... ya da ya da, da ... i call it what of it i can experience, no presumed or imagined entities necessary.  except my own ... lol   then too they will tell me that these beings are something else entirely ... er, wait for it ... wait for it

then too, it is not just me and my meta feelings about what I (think, do, and feel) ... others react to what i (think, do, and feel) too ... and those meta reactions reward or punish my feeling habits just like my own meta reactions.   in fact they are probably primarily what has trained my my meta habits.   my wife, the closest and most intimate person to me, is a strong source of reward/punishment ... but there are others with whom I strongly interact whom affect me as well.

so this is probably standard psychology and not related to the other mystical beings at all ... er, or is it?

this is really all about learning how to swim... see 17301


then too there are altered states ... which inform ...
  1. where the mind is flooded with endorphins and everything that comes to attention has a positive qualia
  2. where the mind is flooded with serotonin and connections are loosely grounded and happen as in an explosion, like an Acid trip
    • with both 1 & 2 i don't know if i  have the biochemistry correct, but does not matter, these are experiential altered states.  (1) happens with me relatively frequently without aid of any drugs, (2) i have not visited since my last acid trip.
  3. dreaming
  4. temporarily holding basic assumptions which are radically different than those which are normally held
    • a sub class of this state might be where the assumptions contradict current sensations
  5. an initiate and/or Satori
(#B) it is useful to distinguish between how *something* feels, and how *you* feel when you behold it.   The first is what i might call a legitimate qualia of the thing (to you), the second is more about your body at the time of beholding ... like for example you might have indigestion, or maybe (1) above, or maybe you are remembering how you felt last time you beheld the something in a totally different context.  all of that of course, is pretty standard psychological knowledge.  strange how often people forget it.


  1. awareness
  2. thoughts
  3. feelings
  4. qualia
  5. swim
  6. altered states
  7. consciousness
  8. item 18160

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