culture - is a useful Birdie

About: the objective world vs the occurring world

Makes a we out of one’s own opinion. Culture blamed insteadof self.

#birdie

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... says

That is neither consensus nor reality. Maybe get 100 of your friends to come up with the definition of what reality is & then get back to me.

To start from thinkmap thesaurus:

MINE IS THAT WHICH IS.

... says

seth 2015-07-17 16:36:20 18554

well if you enumerate what you call "that which is" i expect that you would be writing the same list as i have above. Point is that is exists and dominates what you actually think feel and do. Another word for it might be "common knowledge". Note that that list will also vary between different cultures ... a pigmy's will not the the same as a US citizen's and will not be the same as a Muslim's living in Syria today.

It is hard for me to figure out why you are arguing over such obvious indisputable facts.

Because you are munging. One does not need to enumerate to grasp that which IS.

Seth says

... 2015-07-17 15:16:22 18554

seth 2015-07-17 15:12:56 18554

So what is the process by which a single person's opinion becomes the dominant consensus reality?

Please refer back to the unnecessary buzzwords on the play - no such thingy.

Well when i refer to "consensus reality" i don't mean to point to a reality that everybody will agree upon. Perhaps there is a better term for it ... maybe one will emerge.

Maybe the best way to point to this reality is to do it extensionally by enumerating the things that are in it ...

the sun will rise tomorrow
the sky appears blue to most people
plants grow
we can eat them
animals roam the earth
we can eat those too
we can talk to each other on the phone
we can fly to each other in aeroplanes
all of us know what most of the words in our language will mean to most other people
...
OMG ... there are so very many of these
...

... says

seth 2015-07-18 12:06:45 18554

yep you shitting is not the identical experience as me shitting. But when you shit your experiences are similar to my experiences when i shit. Experiences which are similar like that are called "common experiences".

Maybe by YOU! Not by me.

... says

... 2015-07-18 12:41:12 18554

seth 2015-07-18 12:06:45 18554

Maybe by YOU! Not by me.

I can tell the difference between similar and common. When one munges the two together one then begins to generalize - making all kinds of bad assumptions.

... says

seth 2015-07-17 20:08:46 18554

Maybe a better way to point to this is simply to call it "common experiences". There are many different instances of common experiences in different places and venues on our Earth today and stretching back into ancient history. These are called "cultures" ... or societies ... or sometimes communities ... or even cults ... and sometimes families or tribes. These cultures where specific common experience happen, actually do exist; and those common experiences have dramatic effect on the lives of those people within those cultures.

Doesn't that make sense to you?

So also does what i said today on G+ [edited slightly here] make sense to you?

source: my comment on G+

I think the meaning of signs exists not only in "the individual (subjective)", but also in [a] culture at large. i think that can be demonstrated to whatever level of objectivity is required. humans do not live each in their solipsistic subjective world [whether they think they do or not.] [Thinking that the meanings of signs (or language) are only a solipsitic individual interpertations] is, imho, a fundamental error.

In other words meaning (or interpretation) is not just within individual minds. It is a gestalt which transcends single individual minds.

True, there is language which is expression theoretically common between a few people. However experience is individual. When I take a shit there is only one person taking that particular shit & that is me. Others may also take shits. There may even be language which expresses some aspects of taking a shit which may be shared (the language of the shit experience) but the exact experience is mine & mine alone. Even when I use language to communicate with you the meanings are not particularly shared. The fidelity of communicating my taking a shit is piss-poor at best. I doubt that you will ever have the experience of my taking a shit. The next time I take one I will try to be ultimately conscious of the experience & clothe it in words & see if you can have that experience exactly. The rest of your above is not real just imagination blended with intellectualism & could equally apply to a robot having an experience.

Mark de LA says

Mark de LA 2016-06-02 09:48:27 [item 18554#52559]

same as SOCIETY!
webolths not withstanding.

Seth 2016-06-02 10:05:35 [item 18554#52562]

we and society ARE what is happening.

Mark de LA 2016-06-02 10:06:58 [item 18554#52564]

learn English –

Seth 2016-06-02 10:08:32 [item 18554#52565]

looks like a perfectly formed English sentence to me

… and it continues to ring true. what rule of English grammar are you claiming it breaks?

We is a pronoun – happens is verb .

Seth says

Seth 2016-06-02 10:23:20 [item 18554#52568]

well the words “we” and “society”, and the term “what happens” are all nouns which the sentence equates. the sentence is well formed in English.

Mark de LA 2016-06-02 10:41:39 [item 18554#52570]

http://nlp.stanford.edu:8080/corenlp/process

well the automatic parse is a misrepresentation. The object of the verb is the whole term and not just the last word of it. the subject of that term is “what”, a pronoun pointing to somethning, just exactly like the pronoun “we”.

Wiggle it around a bit and maybe you will see it. We are what? …. er, we are what is happening.

Mark de LA says
subject / predicate

Mark de LA says

Mark de LA 2016-06-02 10:59:13 [item 18554#52574]

I’ll take Stanford Univ over you any day on English & Language.

Seth 2016-06-02 11:09:45 [item 18554#52576]

seems to me that you will take your interpretation of Stanford over what the author is telling you the sentence means. i wonder why you do that. an example of http://www.fastblogit.com/item/1722#comment:52539 ? … i don’t know, you tell me.

incidentally the meaning of my sentence (well formed or not) seems now to have escaped from out focus.

Well you are one who takes words & phrases & redefines their meaning for your own purposes. Don’t be surprised if you look behind you & nobody is following. Enjoy the glow.

Mark de LA says

Mark de LA 2016-06-02 10:59:13 [item 18554#52574]

I’ll take Stanford Univ over you any day on English & Language.

Seth 2016-06-02 11:13:54 [item 18554#52578]

redundant.

culture - is a useful Birdie

About: the objective world vs the occurring world

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