War on Women - #WarOnBabies

Who is actually conducting a war on women, really?  The pro choice lobby has reduced human reproduction to birth & terminating it & reducing the abortion residue to an unviable tissue mass.  Now ( one could say) women have been used to produce tissue masses for sale to the biological community for research.

Tags

  1. war on women
  2. extant
  3. abortion
  4. planned parenthood
  5. war onb babies
  6. WarAgainstBabies

Comments


Mark de LA says
(;-)) 2015-08-18 08:32:09 18693
seth 2015-08-18 08:11:10 18693
i been watching this weekly on CBS.  In the current season the robots are starting to rebel.  i keep waiting for the storyline to break new ground, so far for me it has not.
In the former (season 1) they did not rebel at all there was only Ethan, the kid. Episode 5 of season two, the one I watched last night on Amazon prime things begin to look interesting. At that time there was Ethan & his sister.



Mark de LA says
(;-)) 2015-08-18 07:38:44 18693
A fascinating movie series involving scifi, humanoids (humanish robots) & aliens in a future raises the question of moral ambiguity (Ethical Dilemma in the Wikipedia). What is the greater good? Should action & behavior be controlled by delimiters. In the second season episodes the question gets interesting between the humans, robots & aliens.
I just finished the 5th episode last night. The movie series is Extant with Halle Berry as the main attraction.

.. more about moral ambiguity later.


(*)


Mark de LA says
Actually, it is more like a war on babies!

source: ...

In the latest video produced by the Center for Medical Progress, Holly O’Donnell describes a medical technician using scissors to cut through the face of a newly aborted but nearly fully developed baby boy at a Planned Parenthood facility so that his intact brain could be extracted.

...
meanwhile in Ohio (?)
source: ...

An almost fully-formed human brain has been grown in a lab for the first time, claim scientists from Ohio State University. The team behind the feat hope the brain could transform our understanding of neurological disease.

Though not conscious the miniature brain, which resembles that of a five-week-old foetus, could potentially be useful for scientists who want to study the progression of developmental diseases. It could also be used to test drugs for conditions such as Alzheimer’s and Parkinson’s, since the regions they affect are in place during an early stage of brain development.

... wonder how those cells feel from the "other side"



Mark de LA says
How do they know whether it is conscious? Do they even know what consciousness is from the point of view of materialism?


Mark de LA says
seth 2015-08-19 10:33:48 18693
(;-)) 2015-08-19 10:23:43 18693
seth 2015-08-19 10:17:54 18693
(;-)) 2015-08-19 09:59:19 18693
seth 2015-08-19 09:56:29 18693
(;-)) 2015-08-19 09:36:16 18693
seth 2015-08-19 09:06:33 18693
(;-)) 2015-08-19 09:01:44 18693
(;-)) 2015-08-19 08:58:00 18693
THis belongs here not where I found it.
(;-)) 2015-08-19 08:29:42 [item 18701]
How about pondering the war on babies? One cell decides to kill off a bunch of other ones before they are even fully developed.


Different ponder .   That one starts with a decision whether a woman has a choice to bear a child or not. 


This stupid reasoning is not much of a stretch from a policeman with a gun making the decision whether some other human has the right to live or not because that human may be a threat to the order or disorder of some part of society.


Well, mark, it seems real straight forward to me.   Do we give a woman the ultimate choice of whether she will carry a child in her womb for 9 months and then care for it for 18+ years or not?  Once the process is started, perhaps when she is not in her right mind, does she via legislation from others suddenly loose that choice?   So it is a matter of your story or hers ... your choice or hers. 
This creates a moral stupidity to make it a binary choice instead of a moral ambiguity.  The choice ignored is for the pre-pregnancy-womb-owner not to get knocked up in the first place!
There is enough availability of birth-control pills paid for by others that abortion should not be the first choice except in the case of law breaking by one party or the other.
There is no substitute for consciousness during these moments.

Well we both know that the choice to fuck or not is not a rational choice but rather one dictated by passion.  It is not practical for us to expect that a woman can make a rational choice to bear a child at that time.  The (binary?) choice is who decides and when they can decide. 

And yes, contraceptives are preferable to abortion ... obviously.  Which justifies all of the work that planned parenthood has been doing ... in fact the contraceptives given out by planned parenthood have been a dominant force in decreasing abortions in this country.  My own wife used them for years and years before i met her ... and very effectively too.
So what you seem to be saying that women can't control themselves.in spite of the consequences. THey are victims, eh?

Well both men and women cannot totally control themselves by story and reason .... especially when it comes to strong passions.  So yes, that is a given.  

And people both do, and are done to ... that is the cause/effect medium in which our lives are lived.   So i am a cause in my life, and i am also an effect of others.   That does just seem to be the way the ball bounces.  I can not just wish that away because somebody tells me a story that nobdoy can effect me against my will. 
Yup! This doesn't say anything about responsibility - just excuses & blaming it on xyz.

Well i didn't know that responsibility was in question.  Obviously a woman is responsible because she must suffer the consequences of her actions ... as must we all.   That is not a choice, that is Karma, aka cause and effect.   It is not something that our government can change ... nor is it something that should inform our legislation. 
tangental thought.  karma is not cause and effect. Responsibility for one's actions is part of the law, crime & punishment.
Deal with it.

Mark de LA says
(;-)) 2015-08-19 08:58:00 18693
THis belongs here not where I found it.
(;-)) 2015-08-19 08:29:42 [item 18701]
How about pondering the war on babies? One cell decides to kill off a bunch of other ones before they are even fully developed.


Different ponder .   That one starts with a decision whether a woman has a choice to bear a child or not. 


This stupid reasoning is not much of a stretch from a policeman with a gun making the decision whether some other human has the right to live or not because that human may be a threat to the order or disorder of some part of society.


Mark de LA says
seth 2015-08-19 09:10:54 18693
for me it comes down to my reasoning above ... and must stay there unless we are to suddenly to start making religious assumptions about life for all humanity ... but arguably we in America have already decided not to legislate that kind of assumptions.   
I've already handled this elsewhere. The matter cannot be decided one way or the other by materialism.
BTW, SCOTUS found a right to privacy in the US Constitution that does not exist there & that is why abortion is legal & the #WarAgainstBabies continues.


Mark de LA says
seth 2015-08-19 09:06:33 18693
(;-)) 2015-08-19 09:01:44 18693
(;-)) 2015-08-19 08:58:00 18693
THis belongs here not where I found it.
(;-)) 2015-08-19 08:29:42 [item 18701]
How about pondering the war on babies? One cell decides to kill off a bunch of other ones before they are even fully developed.


Different ponder .   That one starts with a decision whether a woman has a choice to bear a child or not. 


This stupid reasoning is not much of a stretch from a policeman with a gun making the decision whether some other human has the right to live or not because that human may be a threat to the order or disorder of some part of society.


Well, mark, it seems real straight forward to me.   Do we give a woman the ultimate choice of whether she will carry a child in her womb for 9 months and then care for it for 18+ years or not?  Once the process is started, perhaps when she is not in her right mind, does she via legislation from others suddenly loose that choice?   So it is a matter of your story or hers ... your choice or hers. 
This creates a moral stupidity to make it a binary choice instead of a moral ambiguity.  The choice ignored is for the pre-pregnancy-womb-owner not to get knocked up in the first place!
There is enough availability of birth-control pills paid for by others that abortion should not be the first choice except in the case of law breaking by one party or the other.
There is no substitute for consciousness during these moments.

Mark de LA says
seth 2015-08-19 09:56:29 18693
(;-)) 2015-08-19 09:36:16 18693
seth 2015-08-19 09:06:33 18693
(;-)) 2015-08-19 09:01:44 18693
(;-)) 2015-08-19 08:58:00 18693
THis belongs here not where I found it.
(;-)) 2015-08-19 08:29:42 [item 18701]
How about pondering the war on babies? One cell decides to kill off a bunch of other ones before they are even fully developed.


Different ponder .   That one starts with a decision whether a woman has a choice to bear a child or not. 


This stupid reasoning is not much of a stretch from a policeman with a gun making the decision whether some other human has the right to live or not because that human may be a threat to the order or disorder of some part of society.


Well, mark, it seems real straight forward to me.   Do we give a woman the ultimate choice of whether she will carry a child in her womb for 9 months and then care for it for 18+ years or not?  Once the process is started, perhaps when she is not in her right mind, does she via legislation from others suddenly loose that choice?   So it is a matter of your story or hers ... your choice or hers. 
This creates a moral stupidity to make it a binary choice instead of a moral ambiguity.  The choice ignored is for the pre-pregnancy-womb-owner not to get knocked up in the first place!
There is enough availability of birth-control pills paid for by others that abortion should not be the first choice except in the case of law breaking by one party or the other.
There is no substitute for consciousness during these moments.

Well we both know that the choice to fuck or not is not a rational choice but rather one dictated by passion.  It is not practical for us to expect that a woman can make a rational choice to bear a child at that time.  The (binary?) choice is who decides and when they can decide. 

And yes, contraceptives are preferable to abortion ... obviously.  Which justifies all of the work that planned parenthood has been doing ... in fact the contraceptives given out by planned parenthood have been a dominant force in decreasing abortions in this country.  My own wife used them for years and years before i met her ... and very effectively too.
So what you seem to be saying that women can't control themselves.in spite of the consequences. THey are victims, eh?

Mark de LA says
seth 2015-08-19 10:17:54 18693
(;-)) 2015-08-19 09:59:19 18693
seth 2015-08-19 09:56:29 18693
(;-)) 2015-08-19 09:36:16 18693
seth 2015-08-19 09:06:33 18693
(;-)) 2015-08-19 09:01:44 18693
(;-)) 2015-08-19 08:58:00 18693
THis belongs here not where I found it.
(;-)) 2015-08-19 08:29:42 [item 18701]
How about pondering the war on babies? One cell decides to kill off a bunch of other ones before they are even fully developed.


Different ponder .   That one starts with a decision whether a woman has a choice to bear a child or not. 


This stupid reasoning is not much of a stretch from a policeman with a gun making the decision whether some other human has the right to live or not because that human may be a threat to the order or disorder of some part of society.


Well, mark, it seems real straight forward to me.   Do we give a woman the ultimate choice of whether she will carry a child in her womb for 9 months and then care for it for 18+ years or not?  Once the process is started, perhaps when she is not in her right mind, does she via legislation from others suddenly loose that choice?   So it is a matter of your story or hers ... your choice or hers. 
This creates a moral stupidity to make it a binary choice instead of a moral ambiguity.  The choice ignored is for the pre-pregnancy-womb-owner not to get knocked up in the first place!
There is enough availability of birth-control pills paid for by others that abortion should not be the first choice except in the case of law breaking by one party or the other.
There is no substitute for consciousness during these moments.

Well we both know that the choice to fuck or not is not a rational choice but rather one dictated by passion.  It is not practical for us to expect that a woman can make a rational choice to bear a child at that time.  The (binary?) choice is who decides and when they can decide. 

And yes, contraceptives are preferable to abortion ... obviously.  Which justifies all of the work that planned parenthood has been doing ... in fact the contraceptives given out by planned parenthood have been a dominant force in decreasing abortions in this country.  My own wife used them for years and years before i met her ... and very effectively too.
So what you seem to be saying that women can't control themselves.in spite of the consequences. THey are victims, eh?

Well both men and women cannot totally control themselves by story and reason .... especially when it comes to strong passions.  So yes, that is a given.  

And people both do, and are done to ... that is the cause/effect medium in which our lives are lived.   So i am a cause in my life, and i am also an effect of others.   That does just seem to be the way the ball bounces.  I can not just wish that away because somebody tells me a story that nobdoy can effect me against my will. 
Yup! This doesn't say anything about responsibility - just excuses & blaming it on xyz.

Mark de LA says
seth 2015-08-19 10:09:53 18693
(;-)) 2015-08-19 09:41:39 18693
seth 2015-08-19 09:10:54 18693
for me it comes down to my reasoning above ... and must stay there unless we are to suddenly to start making religious assumptions about life for all humanity ... but arguably we in America have already decided not to legislate that kind of assumptions.   
I've already handled this elsewhere. The matter cannot be decided one way or the other by materialism.
BTW, SCOTUS found a right to privacy in the US Constitution that does not exist there & that is why abortion is legal & the #WarAgainstBabies continues.


Well if my memory serves me, this was your reasoning ... (1) it is a matter of faith (2) the government should not legislate matters of faith.

Yet you still are supporting people who and trying to legislate them.  Which is why i went back then ... and still go now when you continue.

 I take it that you are interpreting religious matters of faith to be the opposite of this notion you call "materialism".   Do the materialism/spiritualism stories somehow change your original reasoning ?... i can not for the life of me understand how.
Yup jibberish.  NOT what I said.  I said it is undecidable.  Of couse if you are a materialist & reduce the unborn to an unviable tissue mass you can decide in favor of abortion.  I said it is up to the pregnant-womb-owner & her own conscience & not the matter of government to support, deny or pay for.


Mark de LA says
seth 2015-08-19 10:40:00 18693
(;-)) 2015-08-19 10:29:54 18693
seth 2015-08-19 10:09:53 18693
(;-)) 2015-08-19 09:41:39 18693
seth 2015-08-19 09:10:54 18693
for me it comes down to my reasoning above ... and must stay there unless we are to suddenly to start making religious assumptions about life for all humanity ... but arguably we in America have already decided not to legislate that kind of assumptions.   
I've already handled this elsewhere. The matter cannot be decided one way or the other by materialism.
BTW, SCOTUS found a right to privacy in the US Constitution that does not exist there & that is why abortion is legal & the #WarAgainstBabies continues.


Well if my memory serves me, this was your reasoning ... (1) it is a matter of faith (2) the government should not legislate matters of faith.

Yet you still are supporting people who and trying to legislate them.  Which is why i went back then ... and still go now when you continue.

 I take it that you are interpreting religious matters of faith to be the opposite of this notion you call "materialism".   Do the materialism/spiritualism stories somehow change your original reasoning ?... i can not for the life of me understand how.
Yup jibberish.  NOT what I said.  I said it is undecidable.  Of couse if you are a materialist & reduce the unborn to an unviable tissue mass you can decide in favor of abortion.  I said it is up to the pregnant-womb-owner & her own conscience & not the matter of government to support, deny or pay for.


Well when you say, "it is up to the pregnant-womb-owner & her own conscience & not the matter of government to support, deny or pay for." you are saying the same thing as i said above which you call jibberish.   I just supplied the actual reasoning that you used to get there.  The point is that the decision is up to the mother and not the government. 
Yet I said it is undecidable ! get the difference.

Mark de LA says
seth 2015-08-19 11:18:06 18693
source: mark

tangental thought.  karma is not cause and effect. Responsibility for one's actions is part of the law, crime & punishment.
Deal with it.
... well just go with "cause and effect" we both should know what that means.  Apparently there is no agreement between us regarding what the word "karma" refers to, so maybe we shouldnt use that word until we can agree on to what it refers.

Taking responsibility for the consequences of my actions is a great way to be ... there is no doubt in my mind about that.   That is another expression of the new ages theme, "be a cause in your life".  But we are dealing here with shades of what I can and can not control from within my own being.  This new age assumption, which is espoused by Nathan, that one can always be in control of all one's experience, that nothing ever happens to one without they themselvs willing it ... is total horshit.  It denys fact that we all have experienced ... many examples can be supplied.  The system as a whole just does not work that way ... we are all causes, and we are all effects.  An individual who tries  to be all cause and no effect is  kidding themselves. 
I didn't bring up the word karma here.  Anyway you are going off in a new & different direction so I am calling this item complete.
further comments

Mark de LA says
same it as in your previous paragraph


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