Being awake is being conscious

About: Individual meets collective - comment 58716

Seth says ...
incidentally, increasing the qualia of consciousness inside, does not necessarily increase the consciousness.  conversely perhaps, decreasing the qualia of consciousness does not necessarily decrease the consciousness. 

things might not be what we expect or have been tought that they were … and/or … we may well be talking about different things when we say the word “consciousness”.   me, i am not talking about the qualia of consciousness … that is what it feels like to be awake … rather i am talking about what is the nature of being awake … what being awake does … how it functions … what is it’s effect ← that is what i call “consciousness”.

Tags

  1. consciousness
  2. qualia

Comments


Mark de LA says
So you have separated out the qualia of consciousness, consciousness itself & being awake.  Which one do you have a good firm grasp of? & exactly what is it?

Seth says
both. 

i feel the qualia

and

i know how i interact when i am awake,

and also

i know how other people interact with me when they are awake.

Mark de LA says
So consciousness itself (as distinct from the qualia of consciousness) or being awake still escapes ?null

Seth says
i always know when i interact … and am keenly aware of what i am doing and the responses i am getting from others … that does not escape me.  

of course there are always degrees … and different aspects of being awake.  but to the degree i am awake, that is the degree to which i know what i am doing and the responses i am getting.  and strangely enought i notice that same degree in others.  many many examples available upon request.

Mark de LA says
I am talking about THREE things & it seems as if you have the main topic munged in with a qualia of it & being awake. Please read my sentence (thought 21476%252358725) again. 

Seth says
what 3 things? … i only see 2 … 1) being awake,  and 2) how it feels to be awake – ie its qualia.

You said 2 “escapes” … not sure what you meant by that … but i said it does not escape me.

Mark de LA says
So you have separated out the (thought 21476%252358719
  1. qualia of consciousness,
  2. consciousness itself
  3. being awake

Seth says
“being” in the titel i chose, is to be read in the sense of “being in a state” … you are awake, or your are asleep … that is being in a state of waking, or being in a state of sleeping.

Mark de LA says
I read your item & distilled the 3 above. Still not out of your own loop. ‘s OK am moving on.

Seth says
the qualia and the interaction are intricately related … almost like two sides of the same coin … we could consider them to be different aspects (or properties) of the same thing …. yet they can be distinguished for logical analysis … especially when we consider altered states of consciousness … eg Nirvana, Synchronicity, lsd trips, etc … those are cases where the qualia intensifies and the interaction may decrease.

Seth says

Mark de LA says
the preposition of doth make a distinction between something & one of its properties.

Seth says
yes it does null.   why do you bring that up now?

Mark de LA says
items 1 & 2 in my list differ by the preposition. null

Seth says
okay …. hmmm …. null ….

I hold it to be “The qualia of consciousness”.   … or in different words … “What it feels like to interact with my environment” …. it feels to me like i am conscious.

But i suppose one could also hold it the other way around:  “The consciousness of qualia” … more like “the awareness of a feeling” … but that seems to me to be something else …. more like being aware that you are ware ie self awareness. 

Is that the difference?  

What copula do you put in this sentence:  “What it feels like ← ? → to interact with your environment”   ??

so Mark de LA ,  does this get us any closer to understanding what you were saying about my usage of “of” ?

Mark de LA says
Nope, nor does it get closer to the true nature of consciousness. Wrote something on FB in the Conscious Dialogues page here this AM – (here
nullnull

Seth says

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