Two Dogmas of Empiricism

About: a previous dialogue between seth and mark

The dialogue in the about link needs to be thought about in the light of Quine’s “Two Dogmas of Empiricism
a pdf of which is here → .

Seth says ...
well sum trys to understand things (spirits same things) …
and i always understand in my ontology …
so i necessarily “redo in my words”.  

again …

you understand
in your ontology
me in mine.

your “thanks” in this case being necessarily irrelevant.
#quine #AnalyticSynthetic #AnalyticTruth #facts


  1. AlreadyAlwaysArguing
  2. SoYouSay
  3. quine
  4. AnalyticSynthetic
  5. AnalyticTruth
  6. facts
  7. inside
  8. outsides
  9. SocratesCafe


Mark de LA says
AND yet you ignore that I, using English usage, said EXACTLY what I meant! null … & YOU are still arguing about it.

Seth says
i am not arguing about it.   i am thinking about it in the light of others thinking.  relax dude, this has nothing really to do with what you meant to yourself … this is all just about my thinking in my ontology.

Mark de LA says
KEWL! Than you & I should probably never talk.

Seth says
well in my thinking that does not follow from anything here or there.

effective communication … especially between people with radically different ontologies … is difficult and takes a lot of talking and listening.  if you don’t have the stomach for that kind of effort, then best not to get your panties in a twist when others do.  

you, of course, are free to ignore this thought.  but if you are interested in it, i suggest that first you read Quine’s thoughts on the supbject.   that treatus may or may not bear on our disagreements.  its been a long time since i read it, so i am just guessing that it will shed some light … er, at least in my ontology.

Mark de LA says
#AlreadyAlwaysArguing – maybe learn to use the spell checker on the title too.  If you always have your own meanings then why would I want to contribute to your confusion.  I choose not to waste my time if my thoughts always get garbled in your care.

Seth says
well two minds given the good will to understand each other, can … given diligent expressing and listening to each other.

Mark de LA says
#SoYouSay but what do you imply?

Seth says
only that if there is a will to understand this thing together, it would take quite a bit to expressing and listening.   i don’t even know if Quine’s thoughts will shed light on the issues here … its been a while … but i want to think about them in his terms.   You are free not to get involved.  I rather expect that you will not want to … so if you don’t contribute more to this thought it would not hurt my felling in the least null

Mark de LA says
Yeah, not inclined to look for goodies in a thought or comment with a “Trump’s moral confusion” in the header…. enjoy!

Seth says
… there i fixed that null

Mark de LA says
Someone else mentioned that this might be the problem:

Brace yourself! Mercury retrograde will backspin through anxious Virgo from August 12 through 31, slipping into expressive Leo for the duration of the cycle until September 5. Here’s how to survive three weeks of communication breakdowns without losing your mind

Seth says
well this fluctuates so much between different people and subject matter that i doubt that i could even notice the effect of Mercury … even if i believed it effected it at all.   for example i was able to discuss the psychology of #inside vs #outsides with Bob of the #SocratesCafe yesterday evening and we seemed understand each other quite well for as deep as we had time to do … yet similar discussions with your almost always end in “we don’t understand each other” … so the variable of people is so large that some small influence from the cosmos would probably not be noticable.

Mark de LA says
I think it goes to your #AlreadyAlwaysArguing stand – mismatching quite frequently. NO matter what I say your words reflect back as always skew-wise. Which interprets that you don’t understand what I am saying.
Kinda like this: 

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