What are the limits of liberty?

source: Luke Razzell
In an ideal world, of course, we would all like complete individual control over use of our information all the time and in every context (cf my previous comments on Liberty).
I don't seem to share this ideal world with you, Luke.  In a context where the will of a community conflicts with the liberty of an individual, the community must win out. The individual can then choose to opt-out of the community, where that is possible; or perhaps the community would exclude the individual. But if individuals expect to remain within a community, within that context they cannot expect to be in complete control of  the information flowing from them to it.  Such a right is irreconcilable with civilization. Now you may wish to live in a Utopia where the will of the community never conflicts with the liberty of of an individual.  But i would content that such a community is not any community whatsoever.

Tags

  1. liberty
  2. freedom
  3. identity
  4. weaverluke
  5. my comments
  6. philosophy
  7. politics
  8. demarks
  9. i-together
  10. community
  11. individual
  12. individualism

Comments


Mark de LA says
The old phrase is "your freedom ends where my nose begins" comes to mind here. Also we have a bill of rights which defines & limits how much the collective government can interfere with individuals.  Practically speaking there is no way to opt out of the human race in one lifetime.


weaverluke says
Seth,

i-together's philosophy is to help people discover opportunities to act in ways that benefit themselves ("i") and their communities ("together") simultaneously.

Historically these two sets of interests have often come into conflict, but I'm not so sure that's inevitable?more a product of our collective ignorace, perhaps.

Cheers,

Luke

[response by email would be helpful : )]

weaverluke says
Well the "community" surrounding i-together is not visable to me from here.

<sigh> tech development takes an awful long time </sigh>

Seth says
weaverluke 2006-02-06 05:06:45 2674
Seth,

i-together's philosophy is to help people discover opportunities to act in ways that benefit themselves ("i") and their communities ("together") simultaneously.

Historically these two sets of interests have often come into conflict, but I'm not so sure that's inevitable?more a product of our collective ignorace, perhaps.

Cheers,

Luke

[response by email would be helpful : )]

Well the "community" surrounding i-together is not visable to me from here.  All i see is your writings.   But i agree, assuming that the interests of the individual and the interests of the community must frequently compromise each other is just because we haven't found better ways to make the trade-offs work.

My primary motives in this conversation are better met if we keep it public rather than go to private email.  But i will send you private email notifications.

Seth says
weaverluke 2006-02-09 12:59:11 2674
Well the "community" surrounding i-together is not visable to me from here.
<sigh> tech development takes an awful long time </sigh>

I don't suppose you would consider using fastblogit for some of your community growing.  We do seem to have a working system here.  Perhaps you could at least experiment here and get some ideas about how to build your system.  Later if you want to move it over to your system we can give you a data export or you can use the feed form the groups.

Seth says
source: On The Absurdity of Owning Ones Identity

We'll have to talk about several cases, because Identity is Subjective. There are lots of versions of your identity out there, but we'll lump them into two broad categories: your reputation (the story others tell about you), and your self-image (the story you tell about yourself). For each category, we'll talk about "Control" and then we'll talk about "Consent".

A thoughtful and exhaustive coverage of the subject

Mark de LA says
The bottom line on all of this is that you & your reputation are all still "stories" - things made up - from an accumulation of stuff from & influenced by your culture, upbringing, friends, family, & the rest of the garbage can of existence.  Liberty or freedom is experienced as you acknowledge all that and tap into your own being & become more than just another story.


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