Google NEWS - HA!

Google News is not just news!  This one is even clearly labeled an editorial !
--------------------------------
US needs better defense secretary
Fort Wayne News Sentinel - 2 hours ago
Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld has been known as pompous and condescending. While annoying in a high-ranking public official, these traits are not the primary reasons Rumsfeld should be replaced. The main problem is that he is simply incompetent. ...
Rumsfeld's not done just yet Chicago Tribune
Bush faces real dilemma with generals Birmingham News
Red and Black - Arizona Daily Star - San Jose Mercury News - Pioneer Press - all 368 related ?

Hey Google, STOP doing evil NOW!



Tags

  1. stop evil
  2. google
  3. google news
  4. editorials
  5. right-wrong
  6. just the facts
  7. objectivity
  8. subjectivity
  9. news

Comments


Mark de LA says
seth 2006-04-24 13:08:11 3378
Well we're getting periously close to a right-wrong game here.   You have a good point: Google should exclude editorials frome the news.  I'm just not so sure that calling them evil for making that one mistake (and that is all that is in record so far) will lend any crediance to group UnhackTheBrain.  For dilogue to be more than just pissing in the wind, it must concern itself with the realities of actually fixing the problem. 
My use of evil was to tack on some irony since I had heard that Google's motto is "Do no evil". Not knowing their algorithm for obtaining news doesn't give much of a clue as to why the opinion ends up in the news. I presume they have some kind of a feed arrangement. Separating news from opinion is a primary task of group UnhackTheBrain ! Maintaining a sense of humor in the process may yet insure it's survival !

Mark de LA says
BTW, the right-wrong does insure a continuous supply of input !

Mark de LA says
seth 2006-04-24 07:16:42 3378
These stories evolve ... here is what Google is showing now ...


Hamilton Spectator
Rumsfeld's battles with Pentagon have long history
Boston Globe - 7 hours ago
Donald H. Rumsfeld's battles with the Pentagon brass began long before the Iraq war, or even Sept. 11, 2001. The brash 73-year-old defense secretary ...
Donald Rumsfeld has failed and should go Gulf Times
Generals chose the right mark Newsday
Monsters and Critics.com - South Bend Tribune - Macon Telegraph - Birmingham News - all 233 related ?
WOW! how did you get this list ? The first dozen I looked at were from the opinion pages of different organizations. I like Charles Krauthammer's opinion myself.
source: ... In U.S., it's a good thing civilians direct generals
What's left of the general's revolt? A third complaint: He didn't listen to me. So what? Lincoln didn't listen to McClellan, and fired him. Truman had enough of listening to MacArthur and fired him too. In our system of government, civilians fire generals, not the other way around
... One has to read the whole article to get his whole point, though! In the Viet Nam era everyone hated the generals.

Mark de LA says
I guess then you must be an apologist for their incompetence. Google News has been around for several years AND they DO HAVE the resources. Even I can find the editorial page on most online newspapers.

Seth says
Well we're getting periously close to a right-wrong game here.   You have a good point: Google should exclude editorials frome the news.  I'm just not so sure that calling them evil for making that one mistake (and that is all that is in record so far) will lend any crediance to group UnhackTheBrain.  For dilogue to be more than just pissing in the wind, it must concern itself with the realities of actually fixing the problem. 


Seth says
What would have Google do: exclude the News Sentinel from their sources, or exclude all news stories containing the word "editorial"?  Or are you saying that Google "cherry picked" this story ?    

But cutting to the chase, the story of what these several generals are saying and Bush's childish response is certainly news.   Were it not to have show up in Google news, would have been a serious evil.  


Mark de LA says
seth 2006-04-24 07:07:29 3378
What would have Google do: exclude the News Sentinel from their sources, or exclude all news stories containing the word "editorial"?  Or are you saying that Google "cherry picked" this story ?    

But cutting to the chase, the story of what these several generals are saying and Bush's childish response is certainly news.   Were it not to have show up in Google news, would have been a serious evil.  
I'm sure you are smart enough to know the difference between an editorial & the news. This story should not have been in with the rest on the same topic & in particular it had no place as the headliner. It has since moved on anyway. I'm sure Google is smart enough to know where the editorial page & how not to push it out as news.  If they want, I suggest Google do Google Editorials product if they want to cover that stuff.
The rest of your comment is just your editorial left wing BS.

Seth says
These stories evolve ... here is what Google is showing now ...


Hamilton Spectator
Rumsfeld's battles with Pentagon have long history
Boston Globe - 7 hours ago
Donald H. Rumsfeld's battles with the Pentagon brass began long before the Iraq war, or even Sept. 11, 2001. The brash 73-year-old defense secretary ...
Donald Rumsfeld has failed and should go Gulf Times
Generals chose the right mark Newsday
Monsters and Critics.com - South Bend Tribune - Macon Telegraph - Birmingham News - all 233 related ?


Seth says
M 2006-04-24 07:14:58 3378
seth 2006-04-24 07:07:29 3378
What would have Google do: exclude the News Sentinel from their sources, or exclude all news stories containing the word "editorial"?  Or are you saying that Google "cherry picked" this story ?    

But cutting to the chase, the story of what these several generals are saying and Bush's childish response is certainly news.   Were it not to have show up in Google news, would have been a serious evil.  
I'm sure you are smart enough to know the difference between an editorial & the news. This story should not have been in with the rest on the same topic & in particular it had no place as the headliner. It has since moved on anyway. I'm sure Google is smart enough to know where the editorial page & how not to push it out as news.  If they want, I suggest Google do Google Editorials product if they want to cover that stuff.
The rest of your comment is just your editorial left wing BS.
You didnt's answer the questions:

What would have Google do: exclude the News Sentinel from their sources, or exclude all news stories containing the word "editorial"?  Or are you saying that Google "cherry picked" this story ?   

Point being: How would you change their algorithm?

Mark de LA says
I'm sure that Google is smart enought to figure out their own algorithm. They have bunches of PHD's . I would not put it past them to insert what they want when it suits them. They probably liked the headline.

Seth says
Well my impression, without doing any research, is that this is an algorithm untouched by human hands.  Is that not the case?  If it is the case, then it seems to me that you are accusing them of corrupting their own process.   If you are actually making this accusation, then me thinks you should justify it with more facts. 

Perhaps there is metadata which would allow Google to exclude editorials ... there was the word "editorial" the XML of this article, but there was not categorical marking of this.  But i would bet that there is no agreements in the metadata that would allow a hard-fast separation of editorial from news ... it's not like these on-line publications have an Editorial Page as in the print media. 

Seth says
PS:  Actually the entire channel should have been excluded, it is clearly marked "Editorials -- News-Sentinel".   So is this a case where Google should consulted the XML before scraping the screen ?


Mark de LA says
seth 2006-04-24 08:07:52 3378
If you are actually making this accusation, then me thinks you should justify it with more facts. 
source: ... Or are you saying that Google "cherry picked" this story ?   
... your words not mine. I don't have to do anything with your accusations!
I just said "I wouldn't put it past them.."

This is the way the "drive by media" creates so-called "stories" . They accuse someone, often "out of quotes", of something & them make a story out of their denials or their lack of denials.

E.g. newspaper babe: " I heard someone in the bathroom say that you, senator X, fucked chickens in a woman's backyard at a party in Rhenton "
Seattle Times Headline:  " Senator X denies Fucking Chickens in Rhenton backyard ".
NY Times Headline: "Some question whether Senator X fucks chickens"
etc.....

Seth says
source: ... your words not mine. I don't have to do anything with your accusations!
I just said "I wouldn't put it past them.."
...gimme a break .... you go ..
source: Hey Google, STOP doing evil NOW!
...and then when i try to pin you down to something tangeable your rubber ducker.  Apparently what you want to do is to go around saying derogotory things about their process and not need to justify it in any way.  Well on this side of the rockies we call that dweebing in disney land.


Mark de LA says
To offer editorials as news is evil. Editorials are pure opinion about what the author thinks (just like blogs) & may or not have any real facts to back up the writer's opinion. At least something offered as news should give some kind of pretense at being unbiassed objective news. A commentator usually writes a column and people usually read a column for opinions of the author. Columns usually appear on an editorial page. Your argumentum ad hominem won't change these distinctions.


Seth says
If you notice i had agreed that showing editorial as news is not right.  In my comments here i was dealing with how practical it is to exclude the editorials.  Outside of reacting to your buttons being pushed you might have noticed my only subsantive conclusion ...
source: me above
Actually the entire channel should have been excluded, it is clearly marked "Editorials -- News-Sentinel".   So is this a case where Google should consulted the XML before scraping the screen ?
... but in retrospect i doubt that such exclusions are included in their algorithm.  Are they evil for not making a more advanced algorithm?  I think not.  This is a fast paced industry and nothing at any give point in the development is perfect. 

Seth says
In case you missed it ... here is the point:

To act like bias and subjectivity in that interpretation don

Mark de LA says
seth 2006-06-01 13:43:00 3378
In case you missed it ... here is the point:

To act like bias and subjectivity in that interpretation don

Mark de LA says
seth 2006-06-01 13:09:35 3378
source: Journalism is Broken
The biggest problem facing the journalism world is its ongoing ignorance of opinion. Facts are often meaningless without interpretation. To act like bias and subjectivity in that interpretation don

Seth says
source: Journalism is Broken
The biggest problem facing the journalism world is its ongoing ignorance of opinion. Facts are often meaningless without interpretation. To act like bias and subjectivity in that interpretation don

Mark de LA says
source: ... Google this week admitted that its staff will pick and choose what appears in its search results. It's a historic statement - and nobody has yet grasped its significance.
PageRank also considers the importance of each page that casts a vote, as votes from some pages are considered to have greater value, thus giving the linked page greater value. We have always taken a pragmatic approach to help improve search quality and create useful products, and our technology uses the collective intelligence of the web to determine a page's importance.
Google's New Age motto
...You've also noticed presumably that google search has an X and a promote icon associated with each search result. I'll wonder if that ever shows up on the news.


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