News in the Light of What's Published

   Most news organizations will tell you that if it is news they will publish it. With the Internet so full of space, why is anything left out ? Anything that is news should show up within a short time after the event occurs.  I say that newspapers & news organizations are not unbiased.  There is a purpose behind publishing each article in a newspaper or on TV.  It says something about our World, Country, society or neighborhood.  It says something about our people, crimes, beliefs, memes & so forth. It says something about what was important to a specific reporter who was brought up a particular way.  And, finally it says something about the editors of such an article. 
   The next time you read something in the media it might be fun to inquire to yourself why a particular article was published beyond the fact of it being "news". If you do such with an open mind (really wanting to know) you might be surprised at what shows up!  For extra credit inquire why a particular headline was made for the particular article you are reading.
 ... I'm outta here!


Tags

  1. news
  2. publishing
  3. bias
  4. better truth
  5. drudge
  6. solipsism
  7. pelosi
  8. imus
  9. nappy headed ho

Comments


Seth says
Well it's not news that news outlets are biased and that sometimes they pick and choose their stories to further their agenda.  It is well known that FoxNews leans to the right and that  MSNBC leans to the left.  The leanings of other US channels are less well known.   On the Internet we can read and watch news from foreign countries or regions; and it is no surprise that each country will project a bias for their nation.  The blogosphere is a reflection of mainstream media.  While some blogs are  transparently biased in one direction, others are difficult to ferret out;  for example: Drudge is right wing, yet Memorandum carries both sides.  Yet all sides are sources for we the people.  We pay attention to what interests us.  If one of us leans to the right they will probably enjoy watching Glen Beck or  Hannity and Colmes  rather than Countdown with Keith Olbermann.  Me, i pay attention to the Middle East; so that any story about current or pending campaigns there will catch my eye.  Frequently i watch for stories that do not get top billing on the national channels and then i ask, Why didn't they?  Once i focus on a story i will search for both sides of it considering my sources as i delve; for example i don't think you can really understand a story about Iran without reading the press that comes out of that country.  I rather suspect that some people will read my blog assuming that i will always be projecting a liberal bias; but it is not the case ... i am always seeking a better truth.

Mark de LA says
   I might disagree with some of your right-left assignments in the comment above, but mostly  agree. I think Drudge is closer to the middle, but cut his teeth on the Monica Lewinsky story. The point of the item was not proving bias, but to open eyes toward looking at the purpose an item was chosen for publication.  What is the meme it is strengthening or weakening about some segment or person within our society ?  A lot of them these days strengthen fear. Your 6669 points to an ABC article which is one of those.  The local evening news here in Denver propagates an inordinate amount of crime stories (probably no more than anywhere else) - thus propagating the "unsafe to live here" or "watch out!" or "watch the even news to protect yourself" meme. 
   I couldn't vomit any more than I already have at the notion of a better truth.
 

Mark de LA says
Sorry if the above seems to be a harsh reaction to a better truth.  To me there is truth & then there is falsehood. Better implies degrees of truth - no such thing in my book.  It puts truth in the middle of a grey area where weasels & lawyers live. There is no reason or emotion in truth - it just IS, what's SO!  It's only faulty brains that can't apprehend the truth, can't find the truth or refuse to see it that want to play with different flavors of truth as if it were Baskin-Robbins ice cream.

Mark de LA says
Getting back to the purpose of this item, here is a snapshot of the Drudge Report (at 13:46:32 GMT) that gives a picture of the culture struggle today from his point of view at that time from info on the web. I can't say this is the worse set of headlines I have ever seen, nor the best, but from my perspective if I bought into the headlines themselves I would think the world is going crazy. Digging deeper doesn't help a lot. Memes are going crazy. To what end? I ask.


Seth says
M 2007-04-04 08:36:35 6670
... there is truth & then there is falsehood.
That is only a reduction of the complexity of reality for the sake of mathmatical codification. But as a practical matter if you discover some facts and some interpertations of those facts you have found a measured truth ... as your inquiry proceeds deeper into the matter and you discover more facts and arrive at different interpertations which then match more of the facts, you have indeed improved your viewpoint.   I call that improved viewpoint "a better truth".  As your inquiry proceeds there will be no time where you find a singlar perfect match of facts to viewpoint which you could legitimately call "the truth".  The persuit of truth is a continual process of getting better and better. 

Mark de LA says
Ignoring the continuing movement off topic (without penalty  for now) what you are saying is that your brain & those you gather to your side are slow to find out the truth or recognize (grok) it.  The truth itself does not change only your perceptions of the truth. In a way that makes the phrase a better truth mostly an oxymoron.

Seth says
M 2007-04-04 08:47:19 6670
Getting back to the purpose of this item, here is a snapshot of the Drudge Report (at 13:46:32 GMT) that gives a picture of the culture struggle today from his point of view at that time from info on the web. I can't say this is the worse set of headlines I have ever seen, nor the best, but from my perspective if I bought into the headlines themselves I would think the world is going crazy. Digging deeper doesn't help a lot. Memes are going crazy. To what end? I ask.

Well i get that you don't particularly like the way the world is going ... but, now, beyond that i have no idea where this item is going.  I had thought that it was about looking behind the headlines trying to grok the intentions of the media and participants ... but now i am confused. What are you driving at?

Btw, it's cool that Drudge can come up with a url of headlines at some particular point in history ... i don't know a way to do that at Google news or Memorandum.

Seth says
M 2007-04-04 09:18:49 6670
The truth itself does not change only your perceptions of the truth.
But all you know is "your perceptions of the truth"; it is grave error to think otherwise.

Mark de LA says
They give you good meds for living in your own world. In some countries like Iran they worship you. IMHO dualism is a joke.

Mark de LA says
seth 2007-04-04 09:27:26 6670
-snip-
Well i get that you don't particularly like the way the world is going ... but, now, beyond that i have no idea where this item is going.  I had thought that it was about looking behind the headlines trying to grok the intentions of the media and participants ... but now i am confused. What are you driving at?
That's it exactly! The byproduct of a better truth is just an imbedded thread. I like the World fine. The current tack gets at the message implied in headlines & further on in the content. I could say what each headline in the Drudge archive illustrates about the purpose the writer & editors had in making the articles in the first place.  But, you would have to resort to your better truth to see what the headlines mean to you.  In general, bad headlines i.e. ones that evoke an eek! reaction or stir up the RWG in an individual have the survival meme as target. In an campaign year that could be losses or wins of individual candidates.  
P.S. The drudge archives with snapshots are the timeline entries which begin at the calendars in this page.

Seth says
M 2007-04-04 10:07:10 6670
seth 2007-04-04 09:58:06 6670
M 2007-04-04 09:46:06 6670
They give you good meds for living in your own world. In some countries like Iran they worship you. IMHO dualism is a joke.
Acknowledging the predicament in which we find ourselves does not imply that people "live in their own world".  I don't get you connection with dualism which i take in this context to be a view that "mind and matter are two ontologically separate categories", which view i also reject.
I simply don't like the idea that there is my world and then there is your world & that the twain don't meet.
Have no fear ... they do meet .

Mark de LA says
We'll test that theory, Seth.
In the WFB column on NRO today - Good News Can be Good - WFB gives the parallel between the looser politics in DC about the Viet Nam War when things seemed to be turning around in Viet Nam and the politics today when things seem to be turning around with the surge in Iraq.
Well said
Note there are still Democrat politicians out there who are dreaming for an impeachment of Bush & the glory days of Watergate hoping to cement another left-wing dynasty for many years to come.
Does anyone wonder why all the news from Iraq is "bad" no matter what happens?

Seth says
Well each person will pick and choose which facts to focus on when comparing history. WFB chose to see Viet Nam as a defeat snatched by Democrats from victory.  I tend to hear what George W Bush says today ....  "the Vietnamese people are at peace and seeing the benefits of reform. The Vietnamese own their own businesses, and today the Vietnamese economy is the fastest growing in Southeast Asia" ...and wonder what we were fighting for and why we didn't get out sooner.  Subsequent history has certainly made the reasons given, 30 years ago, look ridiculous.  For Iraq i have decided to use the objective body count, which tells us that civilian casualties are no longer rising ... to me that is good news.  If it were me in Washington i would tell the rest of the Democrats to shut up and give the surge a chance.  Yet at the same time me thinks the long run will prove out the same as Viet Nam ... the sooner we get out, the better. 

Now what theory is being tested here?

Seth says
If no theory was being tested why did you strat your post with "We'll test that theory, Seth." ?

What is responsible for Viet Nam's current prosperity is irrelivant ... what is relivant is the lives that were sacrificed in the war that had no good reason to happen.  Same as Iraq.  That is the point which puts WFB's accusation of defeat in Viet Nam at the hands of Democrats in perspective.  That is what the anti war movement was saying in the 60-70s ... we simply had not valid reason to be there and history has proven that to be the case.  For once it would be interesting to have a dialogue with you where you did not change the subject to make your points.   Also Nixon's opening relations with China still remains his crowinin achievement.  But it has nothing to do with my wanting US foreign policy to reject the Bush doctine ... the one that says that we must impose our interest on other countries by dint of force.  Really, Mark, there is no valid comparison there.  Misconstruing a persons views is not the way to have useful dialogue with them. 

Mark de LA says
The Chinese model of capitalism & to a lesser extent Viet Nam is responsible for change in Viet Nam, not the fact that the US got out.
As an aside, Nixon apparently opened dialog with Communist China ~ 1972.  Perhaps Seth's isolationism in the context of increased modern globalisation will meet Darwinism & disappear in a black hole of global cooling. No theory is actually being tested here. The filter that excludes all good news from Iraq is being exposed for it's politics.


Mark de LA says
The "We'll test that theory, Seth." ? referred to whether we live in the same world - apparently not!  You keep changing the marker as to what you are talking about.  I refute it & then you change it again. 
seth ..
source: ... The Vietnamese own their own businesses, and today the Vietnamese economy is the fastest growing in Southeast Asia" ...and wonder what we were fighting for and why we didn't get out sooner. 
... was refuted by our getting out sooner or later has nothing to do with their success - which is both cultural & due to China's coming to it's senses & adopting some bastardized form of capitalism.


Seth says
M 2007-04-08 15:54:13 6670
The "We'll test that theory, Seth." ? referred to whether we live in the same world - apparently not! 
But we do live in the same world.  Wherever we touch ... wherever ver we interact ... whenever we transact ... as we share a common intention, we are in the same world.

Mark de LA says
Back to the subject ....
WND's Joseph Farrah apparently wrote a book on the subject. Some of the details are in his column. The fascinating parts are:
source: ... A few months later, in an appearance before the Society for Environmental Journalists,  Blakemore said there is no need for reporters to seek balance in stories about the topic of global warming.
... read the article to see who is in the society. Similar organizations exist for the gay lobby. While not a surprise that lobbyists exist & promote their causes. The intimate ties to journalism seem a bit disconcerting.

Seth says
Well i don't get your point .... why don't you seek a balance in your expressions about global warming? 

Seth says
Well, sorry M, i still don't get it.  It is not a new insight that different media is biased in different directions and choses items according to their adgenda.  I'm not sure that, should i be able to wave a magic wand and change it, i would.  Now what i resent is where a network will project a slogan like "Fair and Balanced" and than blatainly do the opposite.  To me that is a lie ... that is saying black is white ... right is wrong ... or good is evil.  Being a blogger does not change your predicament. 

I had thought UnHackTheBrain was all about seeing through bias, yet most of your own items are consistentaly skewed against liberals, global warming, and Islam.  How are you unhacking the brain here? 

Mark de LA says
seth 2007-04-10 09:18:58 6670
Well i don't get your point .... why don't you seek a balance in your expressions about global warming? 
I must have surprised you by returning to the subject of this item. It's not about global warming!  The subject is about what gets published in the media & what the choice of what gets published & the points of view do to people.  The above comment is about what a group of so-called journalists are doing to subvert both sides of the global warming controversy.  They would prefer that only one side get published.


Mark de LA says
BTW, neither you nor I are journalists. At best we are commentators; at worse bloggers! (;-))

Mark de LA says

Here are a couple of stories about Islam vs Islamism (supposedly a segment of the PBS series Crossroads) & how politics of religion & groups figures into publication.

http://www.azcentral.com/arizonarepublic/opinions/articles/0410maceachern0410.html and

http://www.azcentral.com/news/articles/0410crossroads0410.html


Mark de LA says
M 2007-04-10 11:33:09 6670
Your slur about FoxNews is duly noted.  The atrocity is all the other networks who claim to be unbiased & are in the pockets of the liberals. Now that really is a LIE!
When your standard of in the middle is left-wing then & only then can you consider FoxNews unfair.

Mark de LA says
Illustrating the point about distortion by focus in what the media chooses to publish (or is this really news?) is the following cartoon:


Seth says
M 2007-04-11 09:22:15 6670
Illustrating the point about distortion by focus in what the media chooses to publish (or is this really news?) is the following cartoon:
Well one good thing about the Internet vs Broadcast channels is that it promotes consumer choice in news.  Me i tuned out to "Who's you daddy" a long time ago.  The news that i am persuing this morning is about Google to spotlight Darfur crisis first spotted on Al Jazeera and someting i read yesterday at IRNA that was, strangely enough, highlighted by Glen Beck.  Did you know that Sudan exports oil through a port on the Red Sea?  One problem with Google map searches is that if you type in "Dafur" you still get lots of hits in America, but none in Africa.  But if you go to Africa today on GE i don't think you will miss the Dafur crisis.  On the Iranian nukes there is a new card on the table .... i read it yesterday ...  it went in one eye and out the other, but Glen Beck highlighted it and now i'll need to take a different grok.  Not much about it in the news today from either side of the globe ... sometimes these things take a moment to sink in.  All of which says nothing about your cartoon, but if you read it the way i wrote it goes a long way to indicate that if you are interested in the news, that you now have a choice and are not limited by the distortion by focus that is projected at you from broadcast channels.

Mark de LA says
M 2007-04-11 09:35:33 6670
Or perhaps this cartoon relating to the self-appointed political correctness arbiters of Imus' free speech:

P.S. never listened to the man
What's going on here is the PC police restraining what can be published!
For extra credit contrast this with the ACLU's defense of neo-nazis & NAMBLA (man-boy sex).
For extra-extra credit contrast the intentional public humiliation of Imus with that of those offended & see if it is equitable.  (Anticipate future law suits if you can)
This comment is not for the simple minded nor the easily offended nor the feint of heart.  To see the comment in the context of the program & his tonality as well as his words at YouTube go here.

Mark de LA says
True, if you have internet & more usful a broadband connection then you have lots of opportunity to find stuff of various degrees of veracity on the Internet.  Broadcast TV is losing more & more of it's share of the nightly eyeballs. OTOH, for the great unwashed & particularly in other countries which censor their speech it's a big distortion.  In any case distortion exists.  It's up to the consumer to be educated enough to place things within a perspective.  Sometimes it's harmful like the current hysteria about global warming exceeds it's importance relative to other news - see  6008.  I almost posted something on the Google Earth maps about Darfur, but found I needed to study how to navigate it more than I wanted at the time.

Seth says
M 2007-04-11 10:14:02 6670
In any case distortion exists.  It's up to the consumer to be educated enough to place things within a perspective.  Sometimes it's harmful like the current hysteria about global warming exceeds it's importance relative to other news -
Yep distortion exists ... but somtimes it is difficult to separate the evils of "distortion" from the more benign "point of view".  For example you get a vastly different picture from reading IRNA than you do from reading CNN.  Does that mean that what you get from IRNA is the distortion and what you get from CNN is a better truth?  I don't think so.  A part of the story being told over at IRNA rings as true to me as the story we are getting from American channels.  But one must be prepared for all kinds of scurrilous reactions form the blogosphere should one try to hear that other side of the story. Global warming is another example.  You never did answer my question: How are you unhacking the brain here?


Mark de LA says
M 2007-04-11 12:11:33 6670
Yep my views on racism have not changed at all 714 - the race of the racist notwithstanding.


IMHO the same theory applies to sexism, including homosexuality & religious bigotry.  Hillary would be a sexist in my book if she campaigns to be the first woman president & Obama would be a racist if he campaigns to be the first (maybe it's the second) black president.

Seth says
M 2007-04-11 09:40:55 6670
This comment is not for the simple minded nor the easily offended nor the feint of heart.  To see the comment in the context of the program & his tonality as well as his words at YouTube go here.
I spent some time on this yesterday ... it being a craze in my extended family.  It would have taken me way to much time to form an item about it that would even intereste me ... pershap this mere comment will suffice.  I wonder whether the Sharpton media lense on racial language will be successful in getting at the deep seated racial fears that fester in all of us.  I don't know ... like affirmitive action it is a over reaction to an over reaction that may or may not bring balance.  Me i was more concerned with what Imus was actually refering to, regardless of the racial slur and to see that you would have had to watch the game.  He thinks the Tennessee girls were cute ... go look at them ... i don't get it ... they all look like black girls playing basketball to me.  So, unless his trained eye saw something that my untrained eye cannot, he must have just been trying to be funny.  He wasn't, so his bad, and i welcome his apology. But a careere ending gaffaw ... no man, that would be draconian.

Mark de LA says
I'm sure I answered back up there somewhere. But, in any case exposing the distortions & media biases as well as the publishing & lack of publishing decisions made by the MSM is valuble knowledge.  With the knowledge obtained, educating the consumer, there is a certain amount of unhackingm that must go on.  More to come .....

Mark de LA says
On a more sour note, this group UnhackTheBrain can only be educational at this time.  If someone wants to ignore, be stupid about it, or get hung out to dry in an endless RWG there is nothing here to prevent that.


Seth says
M 2007-04-11 12:08:20 6670
On a more sour note, this group UnhackTheBrain can only be educational at this time.  If someone wants to ignore, be stupid about it, or get hung out to dry in an endless RWG there is nothing here to prevent that.
Well all i have seen here so far is just "your bias vs my bias".   To go beyond that we need someting special.  I had suggested the persuit of a better truth (lots of references available if you are at all interested), but that did not go over big with you.  So now i have no idea where this is going.

There are an infinite number of bits of knowledge re biased coverage.  Here is one that me thinks comes under your "watch that the headline does not mislead" catagory.   The headline observed on Drudge is "PELOSI MAY GO TO IRAN..."   Now it would be interesting if before you read the story you told us what you expect to to be ... then read the story and answer the question:  Is Pelosi really trying to go to Iran now?  I had watched the actual press conference on CSpan and the journalist left out the first remarks out of Pelosi's mouth which, were they included in the story, would have given it a totally different spin.   Btw, i think that opening a diplomatic channel to Iran is a super idea and that Bush's putting them in the "Axis of Evil" was the most destructive piece of foreign policy since King Leonidas threw the Persian ambassidor in a pit.  You of course will see Pelosi as sticking her nose where it does not belong.  What might be interesting is to see how our different points of view affect our recognition of facts when we read the text. 

Mark de LA says
Insufficient information.  The Drudge headline said maybe & the article said nobody denied it.  That is MSM-speak for content-free headlining.  I may come up there to Rhenton & kick your ass! That doesn't say anything about whether I am planning to or not.


Seth says
M 2007-04-11 14:05:38 6670
M 2007-04-11 13:23:56 6670
source: ... Well all i have seen here so far is just "your bias vs my bias". 
... Well it didn't start out that way - read the item text.  Drudge's headline if it doesn't reflect the actual article would be a brain hack.  Headline writing is considered fair game for the group UnhackTheBrain. IMHO, I think Pelosi is running for Secretary of State in a Hillary admininistration - I hope I'm wrong!

As far as the Drudge headline I see nothing incongruent although there is obviously more in the story:

source: ... Pelosi did not dispute that statement, 
... Pelosi may go & the not disputed are congruent. What was your problem with the story vis-a-vis the headline?
First, please answer my question based solely on your reading of the story: Is Pelosi planning to go to Iran?

Seth says
M 2007-04-11 15:33:17 6670
Insufficient information.  The Drudge headline said maybe & the article said nobody denied it.  That is MSM-speak for content-free headlining.  I may come up there to Rhenton & kick your ass! That doesn't say anything about whether I am planning to or not.
Ok, then maybe you can answer this question: Did you anticipate that she was planning a trip based upon your reading of the headline?

Mark de LA says
seth 2007-04-11 16:09:37 6670
M 2007-04-11 15:33:17 6670
Insufficient information.  The Drudge headline said maybe & the article said nobody denied it.  That is MSM-speak for content-free headlining.  I may come up there to Rhenton & kick your ass! That doesn't say anything about whether I am planning to or not.
Ok, then maybe you can answer this question: Did you anticipate that she was planning a trip based upon your reading of the headline?
I think we are parsing the meaning of the word "may".  The use of that word is mostly a CYA for either she will or she won't - like you may get laid today!


Mark de LA says
The only meme that I can remember was something like "Oh !@#$% - there she goes again!"

Mark de LA says
Is this news or an advertizement on CNN? See http://www.cnn.com/POLITICS/

Seth says
M 2007-04-11 19:20:40 6670
seth 2007-04-11 16:39:20 6670
M 2007-04-11 16:37:44 6670
Well, after reading the article, I took it as a trial baloon.
The question is who's trial baloon ... Palosi's or the journalists?
Pelosi's IMHO
On what do you base your opinion?  Are you suggesting that Polosi conspired with the journalist to have her ask the question?  Btw, i would bet that Polosi would love to go to Iran, and i would love for her to go there, and she should go there, and in the long run it would be good for the relationship between America and Iran.  Unfortunately there is that little pesky problem of the Iranian visas ... one needs to be invited.  About that invitation (or lack thereof) we know nothing.  So is this trip actually in the works ... or just on an adgenda of a journalist who wants to write a anti-Democrat story?  IMHO, it is the latter.

Mark de LA says
Shock, horror! a politician would conspire with a journalist to leak something, true or otherwise. It's just my opinion. Anyone can run up a trial baloon as long as they use weasel words like might & may.

Mark de LA says
RE: (comment above on the eight dwarfs) - Michel Malkin has a fairly strong argument in her Tuesday Blog here. <==
What we have here is something that was whipped up by the MSM to target a particular talkshow host. How it managed to gather a storm so fast is worthy of those who study tsunami. 
I wonder if there will be a backlash against rap music?  I wonder if the same response would have happened if Imus were black.
Wanda Sykes was funny on Leno last night - thought Imus was already dead because of the way he looks. Of course she asked the rhetorical question "am I supposed to be the spokesman for nappy headed hos?" because she was getting lots of calls from people to comment on the Imus situation. Hopefully it will show up on YouTube soon.
 So the question here is what kind of media phenomena was this? Was it good or bad or neutral or just a slow news week?

Seth says
Jon Stewart had a funny piece about it.  I think it's good that our society is working to change its racism through changing the language that is allowed in MSM.  But certainly that can swing too far. Also me thinks that there is a might bit of hyprocracy involved ... why are black comedians allowed to poke fun at crackers ... but white comedians aren't allowed to poke fun at nappy hair?  Denise tells me that Sharpton said this morning that black comedians are not so obliged after all.  And btw, i love nappy hair ... well naturals to be particular ... it is just sooo soft!  I had made a tentitive agreement with Denise that if i shaved my beard and mustache she would let her hair grow natural ... but alass, when this Imus stuff came up the deal is off because she feared  people would also think her a ho.


Mark de LA says
And now the -  Maybe this is a clue for some people to lighten up a bit! (Are you listening Sharpton?):


Seth says
seth 2007-04-11 16:32:24 6670
M 2007-04-11 16:14:37 6670
seth 2007-04-11 16:09:37 6670
M 2007-04-11 15:33:17 6670
Insufficient information.  The Drudge headline said maybe & the article said nobody denied it.  That is MSM-speak for content-free headlining.  I may come up there to Rhenton & kick your ass! That doesn't say anything about whether I am planning to or not.
Ok, then maybe you can answer this question: Did you anticipate that she was planning a trip based upon your reading of the headline?
I think we are parsing the meaning of the word "may".  The use of that word is mostly a CYA for either she will or she won't - like you may get laid today!
If i say THIS IS NEWS: ... then i say "She may be planning a trip" ... there is a clear intent to imply that this allegid trip started with her intention.  But that was not the case.  The intention started with a jouranlist who asked her whether she was planning a trip to Iran.  I would bet that it was the same journalist who wrote the story.  But the first thing out of her mouth was to say that Iran had not granted any visas to a US Congress person for the past umteen years.  (Now that was news to me) But she had to answer the question anyway and she did the best that she could.  This is a concocted story on the boardeline between making news and reporting it.  For me it stepped over the line.

Well blow me away ...
source: TEHRAN (Fars News Agency)
Vice Chairman of the Iranian parliament's National Security and Foreign Policy Commission here on Friday voiced preparedness to attend talks with the US House Speaker, Nancy Pelosi.

Mark de LA says
Here is another google absurdity:

On Google News the front page shows this on the left.  However the headlines are less agenda driven in the 943 other articles.
The meme I get is that even the conservatives are against Gonzales, divided Republicans, the administration is falling apart. 
source: ... 2 senators apparently ...

GOP Sens. Arlen Specter and Lindsey Graham said Gonzales has a difficult battle ahead in convincing the public he can lead the Justice Department.

This tempest in a teapot beat goes on!
See also government wasting time & money.

Seth says
Well i guess wer're getting more and more into meta news ... what news is news ... and that is actually kind of interesting.  On your Google ... i think the article chosen to headline a cluster changes every couple of minutes and i still believe that it is an automated algorithm, not touched by human hands.  I'm more concerned with why certain clusters don't even make the front pages of google.  Is the cluster choice automated also?  Inquiring minds want to know.

On the Pelosi story, this from Terhan was totally missed by msm, and this from Iraq is being under reported in America although it is front page news elsewhere, BBC, Aljazeera.  In Iran what ElBarade said late last week was dooly noted there, but try to find that awareness in the West ... if you do it will be buried. 

It is not news that news is subjective.   I think we end up learning more about sources and countries by which stories bubble to the top, than we learn about the news itself.

Mark de LA says
Maybe then meta news is important.  [this: group UnhackTheBrain] wants to make conscious the memes being promulgated in hypnotic news.  Headlines have a lot to do with what people believe is going on.  I think that in a lot of cases that the headline writers are more important than the reporters - they are not always the same person.  The more powerful the meme, the more likely someone is inclined to read the article itself.  This is more important effect in the world of summary Internet news than for newspapers.  That a headline should show up in a Google summary front news page that radically differs from ~1000 other news items on the same subject is somewhat improbable.

Mark de LA says
seth 2007-04-16 08:41:24 6670
M 2007-04-16 08:33:24 6670
That a headline should show up in a Google summary front news page that radically differs from ~1000 other news items on the same subject is somewhat improbable.
You seem to keep implying that Google chooses the headlines.  But there is no evidence to support that claim.  I keep telling you that Google chooses a story to represent the cluster, not a headline to represent the cluster.  The headline then just rides with the story that is chosen.
You keep telling me that - where is your evidence ? Got a Google declaration of their algorithm?  You are the one implying anything.  I am not implying what you suggest.  I am saying that statistically that is improbable.  Sometimes when I see an interesting or disturbing headline in google I get them all & choose the outlet I trust to be less agenda-driven than the rest.

Seth says
M 2007-04-16 08:33:24 6670
That a headline should show up in a Google summary front news page that radically differs from ~1000 other news items on the same subject is somewhat improbable.
You seem to keep implying that Google chooses the headlines.  But there is no evidence to support that claim.  I keep telling you that Google chooses a story to represent the cluster, not a headline to represent the cluster.  The headline then just rides with the story that is chosen.

Seth says
M 2007-04-16 09:14:30 6670
seth 2007-04-16 08:41:24 6670
M 2007-04-16 08:33:24 6670
That a headline should show up in a Google summary front news page that radically differs from ~1000 other news items on the same subject is somewhat improbable.
You seem to keep implying that Google chooses the headlines.  But there is no evidence to support that claim.  I keep telling you that Google chooses a story to represent the cluster, not a headline to represent the cluster.  The headline then just rides with the story that is chosen.
You keep telling me that - where is your evidence ? Got a Google declaration of their algorithm?  You are the one implying anything.  I am not implying what you suggest.  I am saying that statistically that is improbable.  Sometimes when I see an interesting or disturbing headline in google I get them all & choose the outlet I trust to be less agenda-driven than the rest.
No, i don't know the algorithm.  The only indication i have comes from my study of clustering which, in all the articles i read, was done on the entire vocabulary of an article and not the headline.  I too have observed that the headline that is chosen, is not always the most probable. Can not clustering of the story itself account for that improbability?  Another factor in the algorithm for choosing the sample story (and hense the headline) is probably time.  Click on sort by time and perhaps the headline story they have chosen will pop up to the top more often.  In any case, i seriously doubt that there are humans involved in the choice of headline stories.  But we will not know until we find more information about their process.

Seth says
There is another possible factor that may weigh heavily in Google's choice of headline.  Let's not forget that there must be a (probably contractual) relatioship between Google and the news sources.  It is quite possible, and i would even bet likely, that the choice of headline story is determined based upon giving each news source equal access to hyperlink juice from their front pages.  

Mark de LA says
So then, Seth, what is your theoretical Google algorithm.  IMHO, the phenomena I have cited defies statistical probability.

Mark de LA says
M 2007-04-18 06:18:07 6670
This AM again, a sample headline seems to be out of line (& proportion) with the majority of the 2026 headlines it represents. 
 Selection of this headline seems to blame police; the rest don't.
BTW, the difference in the count between the all 2375 news articles & the count line in the collection persists & has never been explained. The summary on the front page always seems larger.

Seth says
seth 2007-04-16 10:24:54 6670
There is another possible factor that may weigh heavily in Google's choice of headline.  Let's not forget that there must be a (probably contractual) relatioship between Google and the news sources.  It is quite possible, and i would even bet likely, that the choice of headline story is determined based upon giving each news source [fair] access to hyperlink juice from the google news pages.  
I studied a cluster for about a day ... the headlines change about every minute or two ... my best explanation for this was explained above two days ago.

Mark de LA says
seth 2007-04-18 09:10:19 6670
M 2007-04-18 09:06:26 6670
Hmm..I watched the one I cited this AM for 10 minutes refreshing the page & it stayed the same, went away & then came back.  I will write google in their help page & see what they say about my experience when I get a
Take a look in another half hour and it will have changed.
It's already gone or morphed into 3511 more.  The point is that the distortion (or NOT) was there for a time. I need more explanation of this improbability for the purposes of this group.

Seth says
M 2007-04-18 09:22:10 6670
seth 2007-04-18 09:10:19 6670
M 2007-04-18 09:06:26 6670
Hmm..I watched the one I cited this AM for 10 minutes refreshing the page & it stayed the same, went away & then came back.  I will write google in their help page & see what they say about my experience when I get a
Take a look in another half hour and it will have changed.
It's already gone or morphed into 3511 more.  The point is that the distortion (or NOT) was there for a time. I need more explanation of this improbability for the purposes of this group.
Well i think the choice of headline has no relationship whatsoever to the meaning of the news cluster.  Rather the choice of headline is based upon some algorithm which takes into consideration only the set of news sources that contribute to the cluster.  Perhaps the news source is chosen at random from that set, and likely the choice is weighted by the relative number of contributions from that source or perhaps some other factor that Google deems improtant for its business model to work not only for itself but also for those supplying content. I studied a cluster for most of Monday and the change in headlines were consistent with my model here. Another observation that bolsters my claim is that sometimes the headline changes even when the number of articles in the cluster does not change ... iow it appears that they switch the headline without recalculating the cluster.

Seth says
M 2007-04-18 10:20:48 6670
So then, Seth, what is your theoretical Google algorithm.  IMHO, the phenomena I have cited defies statistical probability.
(1) collect a set of articles that cluster about the same subject using as a critera some threshold of shared phrases.
(2) determine the set of news sources for the cluster.
(3) determin some weight factor for each news source. I have no idea what weight Google might deem important to its business model and the business model of its content providers.  I    suspect that it has nothing to do with the shared phrases in the cluster, but rather takes into consideration the number of contributions from that source and the publication date.  We can observe that preference is given to more recently published articles.
(4) after X minutes choose a weighted random news source from (2) and use the headline from that article from that source.

Mark de LA says
Another example - here is the list of headlines.  And here is the header in the front page:

853 vs 862 in the headline count.

Mark de LA says
Just to round out the Imus discussion: laugh it off!
(I did!)


Mark de LA says
The criminalization of politics seems to be moving forward in this WND article. Will PC be the only gateway to news & free speech ?
source: ...

The proposal has been endorsed by majority Democrats on the committee, and already has 137 sponsors in the full House, making it possible it could be voted on in a matter of days or weeks.

... ( HR 1592 )  1984 has arrived, just 23 years late.



Mark de LA says
Here is an article on come cleverly worded headlines - on purpose or not.

Mark de LA says
seth 2007-04-04 09:13:46 6670
M 2007-04-04 08:36:35 6670
... there is truth & then there is falsehood.
That is only a reduction of the complexity of reality for the sake of mathmatical codification. But as a practical matter if you discover some facts and some interpertations of those facts you have found a measured truth ... as your inquiry proceeds deeper into the matter and you discover more facts and arrive at different interpertations which then match more of the facts, you have indeed improved your viewpoint.   I call that improved viewpoint "a better truth".  As your inquiry proceeds there will be no time where you find a singlar perfect match of facts to viewpoint which you could legitimately call "the truth".  The persuit of truth is a continual process of getting better and better. 
I do grok what you are describing here. I would say that it sounds like the words the truth , the whole truth & nothing but the truth in traditional swearing in for someone who is about to testify in a courtroom proceeding. In that case it is a process of uncovering the facts. Life may be cooperative or not in unconcealing such at a practical level.
OTOH, I usually refer to truth from the ontological or phenomenological perspective & say that something in fact has happened & what's so can be groked ... each additional fact uncovered is a truth in itself ... the whole picture is complete once you have asked enough questions or continue to hold the question open. Better is just the wrong word for me; an adjective applying to the process of gathering information rather than the results. The words whole truth serve me better. For me truth is equivalent to exactly what's so ; the process notwithstanding. We have both just been pointing at different aspects of the same thing.


Seth says
It doesn't make any difference whether you call it "a better truth" or "getting closer to the whole truth".  As long as you accept that Truth is a limit point that can never actually be reached in practice and that the search for it, is a process of improvement or progress towards  the goal of knowing the "whole truth". 

Mark de LA says
seth 2008-10-14 09:28:05 6670
It doesn't make any difference whether you call it "a better truth" or "getting closer to the whole truth".  As long as you accept that Truth is a limit point that can never actually be reached in practice and that the search for it, is a process of improvement or progress towards  the goal of knowing the "whole truth". 
Nope! I don't accept the process notion (or nuance) theory of truth. It is more subject to stopping the inquiry before the whole truth is found by lazy minded thinkers and relativists. As the guy on X-files said so many times "The Truth is out there"!

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