Funnier than most in the funnypages group

Tags

  1. carter the dupe
  2. hamas
  3. jimmy carter

Comments


Mark de LA says
More grist for the mill:
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,351953,00.html

Seth says
Gimme a break ... if this is true ..
source:link from M above
JERUSALEM (AP) - Former President Carter said Monday that Hamas

Mark de LA says
seth 2008-04-21 10:21:58 9875
The situation in Gaza is a difficulat one.  Throwing words at it does not guarantee a solution ... but not talking does pretty much guarantee no solution at all ... or at best a violent resolution.    I hail Carter's courage in voicing a politically incorrect script. 
While Carter is running around saying he is making progress & getting a cease fire the Terrorist Hamas leader is saying otherwise & sucking up status by talking to a former president.
source: ... DAMASCUS, Syria (AP) - The leader of Hamas says his Palestinian militant group is offering Israel a 10-year truce if it withdraws from all lands it seized in the 1967 war.

Khaled Mashaal says he made the offer to former President Carter in talks on Saturday.

Mashaal says Hamas would accept a Palestinian state limited to the lands Israel seized in 1967


Mark de LA says
& this ...

Mark de LA says
& maybe this one is:


Mark de LA says
seth 2008-04-21 11:02:09 9875
Gimme a break ... if this is true ..
source:link from M above
JERUSALEM (AP) - Former President Carter said Monday that Hamas??"the Islamic militant group that has called for the destruction of Israel??"is prepared to accept the right of the Jewish state to "live as a neighbor next door in peace."
... then Carter has produced progress indeed.  Of course these ME "peaces" are always suspect and reversible.   So why would you begrudge even a moments  respite from the  abomination of the Gaza strip ?  Why?  Just because he's not from your party?  Does peace from the lips of a democart taste so bitter?
NOPE! It's an illusion busted by the words straight out of the mouth of leader of Hamas himself.  I hope you don't build your world out of illusions! Carter is still trying to overcome his most failed presidency & paint a successful legacy in spite of his allowing Khomeni to kick us out of Iran & the 20% interest rates & the oil debacles of gas lines.  He is hungry for something on the world stage even if he only seems to do something.


Mark de LA says
At least someone else agrees:


Seth says
Astonished 2008-04-21 11:58:58 9875
In effect what Hamas is saying is that Israel should give back everything they took by war to protect themselves in the first place & for that Hamas will declare a cease-fire for only 10 years. If Israel accepts what will happen is that their borders will condense with the enemy all around them & meanwhile the enemy will rearm (for 10 years) for their final conquest (Palestinians right of return will overwhelm them as well) with Hamas still not recognizing them by saying that Israel has the right to exist. Some deal, huh!
Hamas has said a long time ago that they would grant a 10 year cease fire, accepting that they can live at peace with Israel for that time.  That is nothing new.  And it is extremely doubtful that Israel would even consider a pull back to the 1967 boarders.   I look at these negoatings as a process of getting the cards on the table.  I suspect that you need to be much closer to what is really happening to be able to access what they mean.  But what it means to me is just the first volly of negotiations bypassing the neocon administration that has been in power for 8 long years of intransigency.

Mark de LA says
There is already a road map & peace process with all of the cards on the table which goes back several presidents & administrations, including Clinton & Carter.  Hamas could have been part of it by recognizing Israel's right to exist, but they won't! All you have to offer is an RWG n-word of neocon to the mix. Way to go! The Gaza is a wonderful example of what would happen with any other territory ceded back to the Palestinians. The Israelis left with houses & gardens & irrigated land & businesses that could have sustained the people, but Hamas tore it all down & then began lobbing rockets across the border.
 

Seth says
It never ceases to amaze me that you think the word "liberal" used from your mouth to be so much more palatable than the word "neocon" used from mine. 

Here, i offer you a truce: stop using the word "liberal" and i will stop using the word "neocon". 

Oh, and here is the message you missed: "But what it means to me is just the first volly of [talks] bypassing the [ ] administration that has been in power for 8 long years of intransigency."  As Carter has told us, it brings to the table those who have been excluded during the Bush administration.  The solution, be there one be, must be inclusive of these factions to whom Carter speaks.  Israel cannot annilate them, they cannot be erased ... it is stupid to think that a non-volent solution will emerge that excludes them.

Mark de LA says
I told Seth before that he can call me a conservative all he wants and I will call him and the like liberals. The word neocon has a special meaning which is pejorative & means jew-lover (like coming from an Islamist) not unlike the word nigger-lover.  Liberal and Conservative are just points on the political spectrum. They only have a pejorative meaning - each from the other side.
I wonder if Seth will ever get the point!

Mark de LA says
Why can't Carter wait until Obama or Clinton get in office? Why would he want to talk to those who say "We will never recognize Israel!" now? There is no foreign policy or Secretary of State if each person can decide on his own to go make his own foreign policy. Would Obama like it if Bush decided to go to the Middle East and conduct his own policy just because he doesn't like Obama's?  Search as hard as I can, I can't find anywhere in the U.S. Constitution where an X-president has any official duties at all. Carter is just a bufoon trying to make a legacy where he failed to do it so many years ago.  I like the idea that someone suggested that the State Department should revoke his passport while he is out of the country.


Mark de LA says
BTW, the only people who don't like the current Road map for peace are the terrorists - go figure! Abbas has partnered with Olmert in substantive talks so far. The terrorists like Hamas and Hezbollah who are supported & financed by Iran would be disenfranchised if Peace should suddenly break out.  What does an x-terrorist do in a peaceful & free economy?


Seth says
M 2008-04-21 15:16:34 9875
I told Seth before that he can call me a conservative all he wants and I will call him and the like liberals. The word neocon has a special meaning which is pejorative & means jew-lover (like coming from an Islamist) not unlike the word nigger-lover.  Liberal and Conservative are just points on the political spectrum. They only have a pejorative meaning - each from the other side.
I wonder if Seth will ever get the point!
Mark you are just wrong about this.  You always speak the word "liberal" as a pejorative term, just like i do "neocon".  Language changes ... it may have started ... as a point in the political spectrum as a term opposite to conservitive ... that's the way i learned it in high school.  But recently it has been used so frequently by the right as a pejorative term, it has become almost a political curse word.  If you actually want to refer to that political faction even handedly, then use the term that those people choose for themselves: "progressive".   So fine ... no truce ... just stubborness ... you fascist neocon asshole. Can you see how the word takes on new connotations by virture of the words that surround it when it is used?

Any yes i get your point ... now in its second gyration.  But do you get mine?  You still seem to think that you can take a definition and grock the implications of the speaker ... but you cannot ... instead you must look at usage. 

Btw, i've never heard "neocon" used to mean "jew-lover".  To me it just refers to the new crop of conservitives that came into power when Bush took office and have subsequently besmirched a fine conservitive tradition.

Seth says
M 2008-04-21 15:30:40 9875
Why can't Carter wait until Obama or Clinton get in office?
 ... good question .... one would need to be very close to the situation to actually know.  But i suspect that there are very good reasons for the timing; but they may (or may not) have more to do with Carter himself than with events within the ME.

Mark de LA says
Why do liberals think that being called a liberal is perjorative.  Is it that they want to hide their true nature?  Conservatives generally believe that liberals want higher taxes, more government control, bigger government,  using the tax code to redistribute wealth; using climate change to regulate everything that people do & buy (as much as they can), using the military like NGOs as did Clinton, etc.  Conservatives generally want the exact opposite. Conservatives believe that if liberals actually stepped forward and came out of the closet as what they are they would not get elected very often.  Tell your buddies in the Obama & Clinton campaigns to come out of the closet as exactly what they are & quit pretending to be something else. Step forward and be proud of it.


Mark de LA says
seth 2008-04-21 16:25:17 9875
There is a way for you to compare the useage of words visa-vie their supposed meanings:

Neocon meaning jew-lover = 363 hits at google.
Neocon meaning new conservitive = 22,000 hits at google.
Search neocon bush = 3,270,00 hits
Search neocon jew = 617,000 hits

I rest my case.

Well you might look up google neocon as code word which won't work of course but when typed in google search bar yields about 650,000.  If you can read the WSJ  see Article http://www.opinionjournal.com/extra/?id=110005656 .  The word simply doesn't fit me. Which means if you persist  in using it to piss me off that you are simply an anti-semite as is Carter (from his books). If you persist, I will endeavor to add extra couplets to 4413 to emphasize my point. 


Mark de LA says
seth 2008-04-23 11:12:21 9875
And here is another viewpoint ... apparently Conde is lieing ...
source: Reuters
Former U.S. President Jimmy Carter on Wednesday accused Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice of not telling the truth about warnings she said her department gave Carter not to speak to Hamas before a Middle East trip.

google carter was warned which only works if you type it in shows a lot on the other side.  Between Carter & Rice the only one I would believe is Rice.  Carter talks to terrorists and says one thing for their consumption & another for the US News. 

Seth says
M 2008-04-23 12:41:14 9875
seth 2008-04-23 11:39:02 9875
google carter was warned seems to have worked just fine. What's your problem with it? Note that it puts quotes around the search ... that was quite intentional. 
I appreciate that it is intentional.  Sometimes it yields an entirely different group, naturally.  I would prefer to have the choice to put the quotes in myself like I can do with the Google tool bar.
Ok good point but switching now in mid stream would entail a conversion of old data and/or would not be worth the change.  Note that you can make any specific google search you want jut with a hyperlink to an exact search; for example neocon bush.

Mark de LA says
Update: Mission not accomplished! Carter must be senile his story & Hamas don't agree. And here is another viewpoint from those closer to the action.


Mark de LA says
M 2008-04-23 13:44:40 9875
Yup that is where I found that google neocon as code word and neocon as code word were quite different - 2 vs 650,000 entries.

Some day we will get good semantic searches & maybe the problem will disappear.

Mark de LA says
  Spokeswoman says Hamas' actions 'speak louder than words'    
source: ...

"What I think the president would focus on is, if you go back to what reportedly Hamas said to former President Carter, that they were willing to take these steps for peace, that the very next day, that they went ahead and murdered many people at the Gaza crossing," she said.

"That's why Secretary Rice was in the region," she said

...


Seth says
Anyone with an open mind might want to at least be aware of the other side of this ... in that case i suggest you read Jimmy Carter's OpEd in the New York Times today.

Mark de LA says
seth 2008-04-28 11:39:33 9875
Anyone with an open mind might want to at least be aware of the other side of this ... in that case i suggest you read Jimmy Carter's OpEd in the New York Times today.
Too bad Jimmy thinks he presides over a new country called the "Carter Center".
Notice that Hamas still refuses to ever recognize Israel's right to exist.  To paraphrase MacArthur's farewell speach: "Old Presidents never die I wish they would just fade away!" Many have said that there was nothing new proposed.  They (Hamas) is just stalling for time while rearming & building longer range scuds.

Mark de LA says
seth 2008-04-21 17:15:46 9875
M 2008-04-21 15:30:40 9875
Why can't Carter wait until Obama or Clinton get in office?
 ... good question .... one would need to be very close to the situation to actually know.  But i suspect that there are very good reasons for the timing; but they may (or may not) have more to do with Carter himself than with events within the ME.
WOW! Bush struck back at Carter the other day (see comments in 10103) & the rock hit Obamma!


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